New engine for road race car ?

[mk5.0]

Trying to decide the which route to go on a new engine for my saleen. I plan on setting up the car for some road racing. I am in the process of building a stock block 347 or long rod 306.
I have been tossing the idea around of going with a 4.6 4v or maybe just a 302 crate motor. New 5.0 would be cool but I really don't want to drop 7-8000 on just the motor. I could use that money on the suspension. LSX is also out due to the reliability issues when using them for road racing.

[aggie97]

Need more info....

What class are you going to race in? What will the car weigh when you are done building it? Once you know that, I can tell you how much power you need to make...it might not be much at all.

If it's going to be a track toy, STOCK 5.0 and build the suspension and brakes.

[Mach1]

What is the weak link in a road raced pushrod 5.0? Any keys to making them last?

[mk5.0]

Need more info....

What class are you going to race in? What will the car weigh when you are done building it? Once you know that, I can tell you how much power you need to make...it might not be much at all.

If it's going to be a track toy, STOCK 5.0 and build the suspension and brakes.

What is a good class to start in ? And yes it will be a track toy .

[KBScobravert]

What is the weak link in a road raced pushrod 5.0? Any keys to making them last?

In my limited experience observing/crewing has been valvetrain weakness at consistant high RPM..

Lots of oil and strong timing chain, pushrods, rockers and valve springs, etc.

[aggie97]

What is a good class to start in ? And yes it will be a track toy .

Well, first off, there are no "classes" for track toys exept maybe either Fast or reliable. If you are planning on going Wheel to Wheel, all of my answers will be greatly different than "track toy" answers.

As for 5.0 Motors failing. Most are oil temp issues with rod bearing failures, crank failures and block failures. A good radiator and oil cooler are key. Sure, some drop valves, break valve springs and such but there are ways to make them live. Zero balancing the rotating assembly helps as does a good harmonic balancer. Building a good T-5 or upgrading to a TKO 600/T56 is sometimes a must especially when you go past 260rwhp.

In all honesty, if it's just going to be a "track toy", build the suspension and brakes and keep a stock 5.0 till it blows up. Then build a high quality zero balanced 331 with reasonable heads and a small cam built for torque, not RPM and you will have a long lasting, reliable and fun track toy.

If you are talking about RACING, AND GETTING SERIOUS, you need to figure out which class you are going to run because they run from cheap to holy shit in costs. In order of costs running NASA would be Time Trials, CMC, AI, ST2, AIX, ST1 and then STU.

People will laugh at me when I say this but if you are thinking of building a long lasting, high revving motor and don't need to make more than 330rwhp, a well built 2V works just fine. Just have to build it right and don't get stupid. It also has the broadest powerband of all the current hot combos but can be tailored for just about whatever you want.

Power requirements by class:

Time Trials....stock to Insane
CMC 260rwhp, 310 rwtq.
AI... Varies but 9.5:1 rwhp/wt and 9.0:1 rwtq to wt wt=post race weight with driver
ST2... 8.7:1 rwhp/wt with modifiers for tire size and weight.
ST1.... 5.5:1 rwhp/wt
AIX.... if you can make 1000rwhp last for 40 minutes, go for it. You can make more if you want but good luck.
STU.... well, it's unlimited.

I can answer nearly all of your questions but I have to know your goals first. Otherwise, you go down the wrong path....

[aggie97]

Also, when determining what your power level will be, keep in mind that more power equals having to UPGRADE many more parts on the car to withstand the rigors of track duty in a heavy mustang. Engine is only part of the puzzle when you have to start accounting for the additional heat in the engine bay, rear end, trans and getting air through the front of the car and through the radiator. Then you have to consider how much brake to buy because the car weighs 3600lbs while on track.

Horsepower is expensive and it isn't just the motor! A nearly stock mustang with the Maximum Motorsport grip box can do just fine at the hands of a good driver. trust me, you don't want much power when you are starting but you will certainly want brakes and suspension. Get that first!

[mk5.0]

Also, when determining what your power level will be, keep in mind that more power equals having to UPGRADE many more parts on the car to withstand the rigors of track duty in a heavy mustang. Engine is only part of the puzzle when you have to start accounting for the additional heat in the engine bay, rear end, trans and getting air through the front of the car and through the radiator. Then you have to consider how much brake to buy because the car weighs 3600lbs while on track.

Horsepower is expensive and it isn't just the motor! A nearly stock mustang with the Maximum Motorsport grip box can do just fine at the hands of a good driver. trust me, you don't want much power when you are starting but you will certainly want brakes and suspension. Get that first!

The car currently has no engine so I am in the process of putting something together. I will probably go with a road race spec T5.

The car currently has all the saleen suspension and brakes. It also has a chromoly cage installed and kirkey race seat. I will ditch AC, radio and all smog junk.
I want to keep dash, door panels and interior.

[Darren M]

Stock EVERYTHING, except brakes, until you fix the nut behind the wheel. Once you've got some track time, THEN upgrade. (Sorry, I'm assuming a LOT here.)

[jw33]

I would just throw a stock 5.0 in it with a carb setup and limit it to 5K RPM's. Like it was stated above that will be more than enough to get in trouble with and leave you more money in the budget for all the other stuff. Plus if/when you pop the motor it isn't really a big deal and you will be able to beat on it and not worry about the repair bill so much.

[aggie97]

I am offering my engine complete for sale right now. Im considering an uograde to a coyote motor and seliing mine complete with harness ecu and ready to bolt up a trans and run. Its used but built for this stuff.

[aggie97]

Also need pics of "cage" if its a drag cage it wont pass race tech

[VaderTT]

Trying to decide the which route to go on a new engine for my saleen. I plan on setting up the car for some road racing. I am in the process of building a stock block 347 or long rod 306.
I have been tossing the idea around of going with a 4.6 4v or maybe just a 302 crate motor. New 5.0 would be cool but I really don't want to drop 7-8000 on just the motor. I could use that money on the suspension. LSX is also out due to the reliability issues when using them for road racing.

Not with an improved racing oil pan baffle, I know people going well over 1g with them.

I'm super pro-LSX but I don't think I'd put one in a real saleen car.

[mk5.0]

Also need pics of "cage" if its a drag cage it wont pass race tech

The cage will need some work to make it pass tech.

[Mach1]

If you don't want to gut and make your car a race car, I would run Time Trials.
Check the rules before you start sinking money so you can put it in the right place.