My experience with TrueStreet

[turbostang]

Brooks, I believe the dowel pins that references are being made to are the ones in the flywheel that center the pressure plate. The previous thread posted by teamjacob, and I believe in the beginning of this tread show pictures of the flywheel bolted to the motor with the pressure plate removed and no visible pressure plate locating dowels.

Ah.. after I wrote that, I cant even recall ever seeing any dowel pins in the flywheel to the crank, not on a Ford at least.

You are correct. Clint said its the motor so I went home. That was suggested, which a professional shop would have already known to do long before I asked. So I asked in the phone conversation and it was still refused. So I had another shop do it just be sure. I'm glad I didn't have the motor pulled out before doing it and finding out the motor was good. I think Clint jumped the gun on wanting to pull the motor again with out checking the fly wheel. If there is a balance issue, doesn't a professional shop check the flywheel and balancer before rebuilding a motor? From what I have since learned, it's pretty common knowledge

The part you keep glazing over is that you supplied the shortblock, end of story. Clint has no way of knowing what specs the motor is balanced to, so he'd have no way of knowing what balancer/flywheel 'should' be on there - at least not with 100% certainty. Any balanced motor would likely have a modified balancer or flywheel. For that matter, he wouldn't know if it were balanced at all. You can't 'check' a balancer or flywheel if you don't KNOW what the motor is balanced to - I.e. a zero balance, or a 28oz, or in the case of a 8.2" motor, a 50oz. For example, MY motor is zero balanced, but is a 8.2". You would never know if I didn't tell you, if the pan was never removed, or a spec sheet provided - so you'd be inclined to put a 50oz balancer/flywheel on it. It sounds like this is a stock 9.5" rebuild with forged pistons in which case should use a 28oz balancer/flywheel. After saying all that, he'd have no reason to suspect anything other than internal balance problems, based solely on what you've reported as 'vibration'.

If Clint didn't do the work himself, he might not have even known the dowel pins were missing and that gives even more incentive to stick to his guns, especially after this thread and the other ones.

I think with some tact, you might have gotten this resolved in a satisfactory manner, but that's probalby sunk right now.

[Mike]

Let me clarify a little for you

1.) I live next door to Sean and will be building his 302 for his fox. Just like I built the motor in my and many other cars with 0 issues. So the way I see it, is I posted a response to Sean post not yours. Do you think it is shitty for you to make any joke you have in the past?

2.) Yes I was apart of putting Chris car together. As cobbled up mess as it was.

I stand behind every joke I've made on this forum.

[SMEGMA STENCH]

Fuck you, you stupid cunt.

u mad bro ?


LOL

[Blackpony]

I stand behind every joke I've made on this forum.

[TrueStreetMotorSports.com]

Ok, So I understand this.

He brought the motor after his machine shop put it together & then brought the car to you guys with all the other parts. IE Heads & Headers & Intake & PS Pump & yada yada.

Car leaves & returns with a vibration. You guys think it has to do with Machine shops work

Correct, crank, rods, pistons, rings, bearing, we're all installed in block when it showed up. Car left and came back about a month later with a bad vibration. We met the customer on a Sunday for him to drop it off so we could look at it. All front accessories were lose and falling off. We took all the belts off the car and started it. Had a very bad vibration, so at no charge to customer we over nighted a new balancer and installed it. Same issue same problem.... Called the customer and said the motor had not been rebalanced with the new pistons and connecting rods. I told him I thought that was problem and that was not something we did so would not cover

[SEB]

Correct, crank, rods, pistons, rings, bearing, we're all installed in block when it showed up. Car left and came back about a month later with a bad vibration. We met the customer on a Sunday for him to drop it off so we could look at it. All front accessories were lose and falling off. We took all the belts off the car and started it. Had a very bad vibration, so at no charge to customer we over nighted a new balancer and installed it. Same issue same problem.... Called the customer and said the motor had not been rebalanced with the new pistons and connecting rods. I told him I thought that was problem and that was not something we did so would not cover

Ok now its starting to make sense on your end!

So this had nothing to do with missing Dowl pins at all causing the vibration.

[Shaggin Wagon]

I think the lesson learned here by the shop is to not let customers bring you a motor built by someone else other than you or one of your sublet vendors. Maybe this happens a lot, I don't know. I would not paint a car if someone brought me a car in primer and said they wanted it painted. I feel there's too much risk for problems down the road if the car peels. Also, I won't do just the bodywork only and it picked up in primer. I have to do all or nothing. In my 3 years on managing a bodyshop,I've learned, people are crazy and you want to minimize risk of problems as much as possible.

[sonicbluegt]

First place I'm surprised a shop even took this train wreck in to begin with. Second those dowel pins are not what would cause a vibration that would shake your accessories off your car not in my experience. If the motor was not balanced my guess is it shook the dowels out since there not pressed. Why would you still drove it knowing there was a bad vibration?

[snacksnack]

I will try to make this simple since it looks like some have not understood my post

Customer claimed a vibration.

Shop ask for the car to come in for us to check it out

Car comes in and finds out the motor has new pistons and connecting rods and was not balanced

Shop advised customer that they believe that is the problem.

Shop also advised if it turns out the problem is something else the shop made a mistake on they would cover it.

Customer filed law suit, customer called BBB and caused problems for said shop

again said shop said they would stand behind there work, but if the problems turn out to be motor related it would be on the customer...

Customer now claims there are dowls missing on flywheel, shop claims the dowls were there......

Did I mention we finished car and it took 4 months to get paid? Did I also mention we met customer at shop on Sunday (our day off) since it was his only day off.

There is a lot more to this story that is just not worth keeping this bashing of my shop alive. But please before bashing my shop true street...... Look at the history of teamjacob and his bashing of another shop not even a year ago with the same he said she said story...... Look at his track record of post and how he takes care of business. Then look at our track record. We are not perfect but we stand behind what we do and are customer reviews tell the story. Do some research before reading one thread and deciding if we are a trustworthy shop or not.

Clint

Let me ask you this, since you thought that the motor was the problem and you had those intention's while removing and disassemble we can only assume you would have had the engine balanced at this time?

Now from what we know there was clutch damage and missing dowels, would this have been discovered and stopped the motor from being balanced? or would the motor be balanced and charged to the customer (since this wasn't your problem to begin with) even if there was still a vibration after it had been reassembled?

There apparently was clutch damage and possibly dowels missing causing this yet you don't want to agree with this? You want to pull other aspect of the guy into this rather then what may be fact on the engine as to weather or not you stand behind it?


Also your tech is saying he put them in, was this as far as 6 months out that the dowels were brought to attention? How would the tech HONESTLY know weather he did or didn't? What tech at this point is going to say "oh yeah i forgot to do that"


Of course the flip side of all this is once there was a problem it shouldnt have been driven anymore regardless of money or how far away the shop is until something is worked out.

[Blackpony]

I think the lesson learned here by the shop is to not let customers bring you a motor built by someone else other than you or one of your sublet vendors. Maybe this happens a lot, I don't know. I would not paint a car if someone brought me a car in primer and said they wanted it painted. I feel there's too much risk for problems down the road if the car peels. Also, I won't do just the bodywork only and it picked up in primer. I have to do all or nothing. In my 3 years on managing a bodyshop, people are crazy and you want to minimize risk of problems as much as possible.

Yes this is very true! We do our best to help anyone that walks in, we try and stay fair on our prices and stand behind our work. Sometimes that is hard to do when your not given a chance to. I have been in a similar situation in the past, i returned to the business and gave them the chance to make it right, they did and we all went on our way..

[TEAMJACOB]

i can do this all day. just because you type it does not make it true

I will try to make this simple since it looks like some have not understood my post

Customer claimed a vibration.
true

Shop ask for the car to come in for us to check it out
true

Car comes in and finds out the motor has new pistons and connecting rods and was not balanced
has new pistons, stock rods stock crank. not rebalanced.
Shop advised customer that they believe that is the problem.
after only looking at the balancer and refusing to look at flywheel
Shop also advised if it turns out the problem is something else the shop made a mistake on they would cover it.
show me where you said you will take it in and look at the flywheel with out charging
Customer filed law suit, customer called BBB and caused problems for said shop
i gradually increased my efforts to resolve this, i havent filed suit as of right now. only sent letter of intent. my intentions are not to cause problems
again said shop said they would stand behind there work, but if the problems turn out to be motor related it would be on the customer...
already covered this one
Customer now claims there are dowls missing on flywheel, shop claims the dowls were there......
this is the first time you have claimed the dowels were there. you sure havent spoken to me outside this thread. so what if i have an invoice from a shop, not a neighbor working in his garage, that says he pulled the tranny, and there werent dowels, he put dowels in it, as well as rear main seal, throw out bearing, pilot bearing, clutch fork and now the car is perfect? what if i let you drive it? what if toby can get under the car and still see where he used gasket and finger globbed silicon
Did I mention we finished car and it took 4 months to get paid? Did I also mention we met customer at shop on Sunday (our day off) since it was his only day off. half way true. i did struggle to pay you. Tim told me ya'll would work as i paid because as posted on this board, i took a 30k paycut. i sold off my black supercharged car to make right and get you guys paid. if this is a statement that is merely saying, it delayed progress on completion, true. if you are saying you ever had to chase me down or you were getting a $300 to $1500 installment at least every 7 to 10 days, false. lol at the sunday thing though. since you brought it up, i paid over the phone and the car was left outside with the key hidden for me to come pick up. i grab my girl and two kids and drive 70miles to true street and ya'll left it for me with out putting it back together. show them that pm or better yet i will. so tim, who has called me numerous times on my cell phone during this time, doesnt answer when i call him, i call toby who probably didnt recognize my number and answered by mistake answers. says he'll call tim. an hour and half later after numerous calls and pms from the parking lot tim answers and says he will come up there. cool that he came but wouldnt have been necessary if the car was put back together. anyway, i had to leave so they could finish and drive 70 miles back home without my car and go back again on wed
here is the pm

Hey clint,
Chris here. It s Sunday at 2 pm and I have just drive 60 miles with my wife and 2 sons on my only day off to pick up my car. Tim and i agreed to hide the keys in the gas tank door which was done but the car is not put back together. I called Tim with no answer and then called Toby who said he would try Tim for me. Well we are sitting in the parking lot so if you get this call me 817 9387539

There is a lot more to this story that is just not worth keeping this bashing of my shop alive. But please before bashing my shop true street...... Look at the history of teamjacob and his bashing of another shop not even a year ago with the same he said she said story...... Look at his track record of post and how he takes care of business. Then look at our track record. We are not perfect but we stand behind what we do and are customer reviews tell the story. Do some research before reading one thread and deciding if we are a trustworthy shop or not.

Clint

like i said, attach my personality but you havent provided anything other than your opinion that supports what you say

[turbostang]

First place I'm surprised a shop even took this train wreck in to begin with. Second those dowel pins are not what would cause a vibration that would shake your accessories off your car not in my experience. If the motor was not balanced my guess is it shook the dowels out since there not pressed. Why would you still drove it knowing there was a bad vibration?

You can't 'shake the dowels out' as they are stepped, the flywheel side is 8MM, and the pressure plate side is somewhere around 7MM. They are trapped...and yes, they are interference fit.

[TEAMJACOB]

Ah.. after I wrote that, I cant even recall ever seeing any dowel pins in the flywheel to the crank, not on a Ford at least.



The part you keep glazing over is that you supplied the shortblock, end of story. Clint has no way of knowing what specs the motor is balanced to, so he'd have no way of knowing what balancer/flywheel 'should' be on there - at least not with 100% certainty. Any balanced motor would likely have a modified balancer or flywheel. For that matter, he wouldn't know if it were balanced at all. You can't 'check' a balancer or flywheel if you don't KNOW what the motor is balanced to - I.e. a zero balance, or a 28oz, or in the case of a 8.2" motor, a 50oz. For example, MY motor is zero balanced, but is a 8.2". You would never know if I didn't tell you, if the pan was never removed, or a spec sheet provided - so you'd be inclined to put a 50oz balancer/flywheel on it. It sounds like this is a stock 9.5" rebuild with forged pistons in which case should use a 28oz balancer/flywheel. After saying all that, he'd have no reason to suspect anything other than internal balance problems, based solely on what you've reported as 'vibration'.

If Clint didn't do the work himself, he might not have even known the dowel pins were missing and that gives even more incentive to stick to his guns, especially after this thread and the other ones.

I think with some tact, you might have gotten this resolved in a satisfactory manner, but that's probalby sunk right now.

Correct, crank, rods, pistons, rings, bearing, we're all installed in block when it showed up. Car left and came back about a month later with a bad vibration. We met the customer on a Sunday for him to drop it off so we could look at it. All front accessories were lose and falling off. We took all the belts off the car and started it. Had a very bad vibration, so at no charge to customer we over nighted a new balancer and installed it. Same issue same problem.... Called the customer and said the motor had not been rebalanced with the new pistons and connecting rods. I told him I thought that was problem and that was not something we did so would not cover

Ok now its starting to make sense on your end!

So this had nothing to do with missing Dowl pins at all causing the vibration.

all of this justifies an issue in the internal balance of the motor. clint diagnosed that after swapping a balancer only. this has nothing to do with a balanced motor. he only thought that was the problem and this was his out and why he wouldnt look at all unless he was paid. the only problem the car had, as it turns out, is dowel pins were not installed, and this was the source of my vibration. the dowels were placed in and now without ever pulling that motor, the car seizes to have any vibration issues what so ever.

[Shaggin Wagon]

Yes this is very true! We do our best to help anyone that walks in, we try and stay fair on our prices and stand behind our work. Sometimes that is hard to do when your not given a chance to. I have been in a similar situation in the past, i returned to the business and gave them the chance to make it right, they did and we all went on our way..

I use say yes to anyone on anything, after I got bit enough times, I learned to say "no".

[Mach1]

You can't 'shake the dowels out' as they are stepped, the flywheel side is 8MM, and the pressure plate side is somewhere around 7MM. They are trapped...and yes, they are interference fit.