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wicked diff carnage... I summon expert opinions

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  • wicked diff carnage... I summon expert opinions

    I should first state that my original assessment was the diff was trash and I wasn't willing to deal with it, and planned on installing a built 8.8 in the rear and calling it a day. Today, I had a conversation with Justin at A/T Fab and he made a concerted effort to convince me to keep the D44 and avoid the evil 8.8 at all costs. So, I figured what the hell, I'll tear it down and see what's wrong. From the sounds of it I assumed the spider gears were torn up, and the bearings were shot, and I was hoping the ring and pinion were at least salvageable. However, I got to thinking today. I have a sneaking suspicion that one of my tubes may be bent. I can't confirm it for certain, but the jeep does have a pretty nasty alignment, and my rear right tire is pretty darn bald in comparison. Now, keep in mind I just bought the jeep a few weeks ago, and the previous owner just didn't care about all the wonderful noises back there. He might have just done burnouts for fun or something, I don't know. Also, every seal is leaking on the diff.

    Anyways, here is what I'm dealing with.









    Needless to say....



    Now.... What do you guys think my best option is? I have chewed up spider gears, a heck of a lot of metal in the tubes, ruined bearings, chewed up retainers.... maybe a bent tube?

    Now, what I want to know is how did this happen exactly? It should be mentioned that although the jeep doesn't appear to have been hit from the side, I do know that it was probably rolled over, and the diff does NOT sit even with the tub, it seems to be slightly knocked out to the driverside... however the jeep fell on the driverside, so I would expect it to be knocked out to the passenger side. I didn't see any damage to the control arms or the pedestals. Tomorrow I'm going to pull the carrier out and peer down the tube to see if it looks bent at all. What could call something like this? The seals go out, the diff gets run dry (and it was **** near dry when I bought it), the bearings go out, the retainers grab bearing pieces and other metal and grind up against the tube, the metal works its way into the carrier and chews up the spider gears... but completely misses the ring and pinion...?

    I'm at a loss. What do you guys think? Toss it, or try to rebuild it?
    Last edited by CJ; 05-03-2011, 08:25 PM.
    "When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic." -Benjamin Franklin
    "A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury." -Alexander Fraser Tytler

  • #2
    Toss it

    Comment


    • #3
      Toss it. Calling that trashed would be an understatement. What's your aversion to the 8.8?

      Comment


      • #4
        Military axles ftw.
        www.dfwdirtriders.com

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Mustangman_2000 View Post
          Toss it. Calling that trashed would be an understatement. What's your aversion to the 8.8?
          Nothing at all, I think it's considerably stronger than a Dana44, but for some reason the jeep shops think they suck. I spent about 15 minutes debating his theory. He couldn't seem to form any sound explanation for why a 8.8 isn't as good as a Dana44 - larger ring, bigger pinion, larger case, larger axles, thicker tubes, etc.. he just complained about c-clips and lateral load off roading and didn't really have much more than that. Then he told me that Corvette's run Dana44's and they don't break. I told him I have a corvette and it's a getrag diff and I've blown mine up 3 different times. We didn't really go much further after that.
          "When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic." -Benjamin Franklin
          "A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury." -Alexander Fraser Tytler

          Comment


          • #6
            they want to sell you more parts.....

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by jw33 View Post
              they want to sell you more parts.....
              Haha, certainly could be the case. I'm pretty damn sure an 8.8 is a hell of a lot stronger than a Dana44 - every test I know if says the same thing. I know they tend to spin tubes though - I figured a quick bridge and welding the tubes would solve that. However, replacing some spider gears and pressing some new bearings/seals on is a hell of a lot easier than stripping down an 8.8, grinding brackets, fabricating new ones, setting pinion angle, measuring, welding brackets, spacers on the wheels, etc.
              "When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic." -Benjamin Franklin
              "A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury." -Alexander Fraser Tytler

              Comment


              • #8
                I think the C4 Vette's had Dana 44's but they got blown up reguarly if driven very hard. I would stuff an 8.8 under it if you are just light off roading, if you are gonna get heavy into it, duece and half axles lol.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by 5.0_CJ View Post
                  Nothing at all, I think it's considerably stronger than a Dana44, but for some reason the jeep shops think they suck. I spent about 15 minutes debating his theory. He couldn't seem to form any sound explanation for why a 8.8 isn't as good as a Dana44 - larger ring, bigger pinion, larger case, larger axles, thicker tubes, etc.. he just complained about c-clips and lateral load off roading and didn't really have much more than that. Then he told me that Corvette's run Dana44's and they don't break. I told him I have a corvette and it's a getrag diff and I've blown mine up 3 different times. We didn't really go much further after that.
                  That's just because a Jeep shop wants you stick with Dana and not push a Ford rear end. 8.8s can be built to where they are almost bullet proof. Hell, a S197 has a 3 link, 31 spline axles, 31 spline diff w/carbon clutches stock from the factory. Those are fairly hard to break. My buddy has a '78 Luv truck with a 9" Ford w/4.86 gears and 33 spline axles. And he's been trying his best to break it with a Dennis Weld built 388 SBC, glide, and 200 shot on full slicks. No luck on breaking anything but his wallet on 110 octane VP fuel.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Several guys on the major Jeep forums have done 8.8 swaps with no problems.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Mustangman_2000 View Post
                      Several guys on the major Jeep forums have done 8.8 swaps with no problems.
                      Oh I know... The TJ Dana44's are really sought after expensive diffs... a good condition one is worth about $700-1000. If I rebuilt it and then sell it I would make a nice profit - which I've considered. the only concerns about the 8.8 is it's about an inch shorter in length so I might need to run spacers, but frankly I don't really care aesthetically - just a lot of fab ahead of me if I go that route. I'm considering picking up a pair of Set10's, replacing the pinion bearing, pressing on new axle bearings and retainers, and throwing some used spider gears in there and see what happens.
                      Last edited by CJ; 05-03-2011, 09:05 PM.
                      "When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic." -Benjamin Franklin
                      "A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury." -Alexander Fraser Tytler

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        True. What I noticed on the Jeep forums is you have two types of mindsets. You have the hard core enthusiasts that think it's Dana or nothing. And you have some that are little more open minded and practical. Dana44 is a tough unit. However, if you can build a cheaper 8.8 that'll take the punishment, then it's a win. As you mentioned, wheel spacers gives you the work around. It's personal preference, I guess. For some people it just comes down to money, thus the 8.8 conversion. Easy to come buy. Toss a little pocket change at it and go crawling.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by 5.0_CJ View Post
                          Oh I know... The TJ Dana44's are really sought after expensive diffs... a good condition one is worth about $700-1000. If I rebuilt it and then sell it I would make a nice profit - which I've considered. the only concerns about the 8.8 is it's about an inch shorter in length so I might need to run spacers, but frankly I don't really care aesthetically - just a lot of fab ahead of me if I go that route. I'm considering picking up a pair of Set10's, replacing the pinion bearing, pressing on new axle bearings and retainers, and throwing some used spider gears in there and see what happens.
                          1" longer per side or total?

                          you know there are multiple 8.8 flange/flange widths, right?
                          http://www.truthcontest.com/entries/...iversal-truth/

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Cooter View Post
                            1" longer per side or total?

                            you know there are multiple 8.8 flange/flange widths, right?
                            I believe its 1" overall, but I've heard as much as 2". I'm going to use a 31 spline explorer diff which are all the same.
                            "When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic." -Benjamin Franklin
                            "A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury." -Alexander Fraser Tytler

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              31 spline explorer diff is just the diff... I'm assuming you're also planning on using the expy axle housing?
                              http://www.truthcontest.com/entries/...iversal-truth/

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