Any home appraisers out there?...

[MattB]

Damn! I've never seen Rreemo this mad!

[mstng86]

Me thinks I lost my post count in here.

Those floors do look good.

[Pro88LX]

Me thinks I lost my post count in here.

Those floors do look good.

LOL!

and yea, those floors look sick!

[Stoner]

We could always overlay it and stain it

What does something like that cost for say a 10 x 12 room? Are they very slick to walk on? Almost looks wet.

[Rreemo]

LMFAO you asked for an answer and didnt like the factual, personal knowledge based one you got, so you call me a dick? Go fuck yourself. I wasn't being a dick, i was explaining the situation, but enjoy the 500 dollar assfucking you just got on your appraisal you cant use.

I flew off the handle on you....I apologize.

But let me ask....I shouldn't be pissed that they initially told me this wouldn't be a problem? I was completely up-front with them as a precaution, yet they urged me to move forward now, and it turns up like this anyway?

FWIW I wasn't trying to tell the guy how to do his job, but instead relaying what expectation had already been set with me by the people that sent him out here, I was asking the guy questions to help me understand, I mean after-all, I am paying the guy...I should be able to ask questions.

The guy's attitude could have changed the entire outcome, had he simply stated it to me in a calm professional way that apparently is out of his control...yeah I'd get that, but he didn't...he made it sound as if this was just all his own opinion and my wife and I are both clueless. Instead he actually immediately flew off the handle....starts telling me "I'm crazy if I think I'd ever get $X amount for this house"....this was just in response to me pointing out facts about a house 2-blocks away that just sold after 10-days on the market....that house is ~300sqft smaller (if you count my media room), is on a smaller lot and a busier street (I'm on a cul-de-sac), it is 3 baths, mine is 3.5, it has a 3-car garage where mine has a 4-car that was also built 28' deep...I could go on-&on with all the custom crap and built-ins, extra concrete, RV parking, landscaping, security/video surveillance, etc, etc that this other house doesn't have compared to mine. Yet this dipshit is standing here telling me my house is going to appraise ~$60K less than this other one sold for a couple weeks ago, and "I'd be lucky to get anywhere near that"....his response was that the other sell was probably just a fluke.

Now seriously...does this sound normal of a home appraiser to you? If so, then I guess I just don't need to deal with these people.

Personally, I think the guy had already done the appraisal before he ever came out here, just based off of shit online that happens to be totally incorrect on my property....and once out here it pissed him off that he might actually have to do some due diligence (or actually have to do his job). It's telling to me that when he called to setup the appt. he told my wife he'd only need to be here for 15-20 minutes....that tells me he had his number before he ever got here.

BTW - the appraisal was supposed to be $475, but since I asked his rude ass to leave after he interrupted and spoke over my wife 4-5 times, he obviously didn't complete it. The mortgage broker gave me a full refund accompanied by an apology this morning....so I'm out nothing but some frustration.

I'd like to think they aren't all like this one.

[Pro88LX]

I flew off the handle on you....I apologize. .

No worries

But let me ask....I shouldn't be pissed that they initially told me this wouldn't be a problem? I was completely up-front with them as a precaution, yet they urged me to move forward now, and it turns up like this anyway?.

Be pissed at your broker, not the guy who isnt affiliated with them thats in your house trying to do his job

FWIW I wasn't trying to tell the guy how to do his job, but instead relaying what expectation had already been set with me by the people that sent him out here, I was asking the guy questions to help me understand, I mean after-all, I am paying the guy...I should be able to ask questions. .

Asking a question is ok. you were arguing with the guy about whether or not you could use the "partial value" according to your post

The guy's attitude could have changed the entire outcome, had he simply stated it to me in a calm professional way that apparently is out of his control...yeah I'd get that, but he didn't...he made it sound as if this was just all his own opinion. Instead he actually immediately flew off the handle....starts telling me "I'm crazy if I think I'd ever get $X amount for this house"....this was just in response to me pointing out facts about a house 2-blocks away that just sold after 10-days on the market....that house is ~300sqft smaller (if you count my media room), is on a smaller lot and a busier street (I'm on a cul-de-sac), it is 3 baths, mine is 3.5, it has a 3-car garage where mine has a 4-car that was also built 28' deep...I could go on-&on with all the custom crap and built-ins, extra concrete, RV parking, landscaping, security/video surveillance, etc, etc that this other house doesn't have compared to mine. Yet this dipshit is standing here telling me my house is going to appraise ~$60K less than this other one sold for a couple weeks ago, and "I'd be lucky to get anywhere near that"....his response was that the other sell was probably just a fluke. .

well in his defense he isnt allowed/supposed to discuss his valuation methods or opinion of value with wither the broker or homeowner. appraiser has no idea what the value is until he does his research on comparable sales AFTER he performs the inspection. If your house is in line with the comps then it should be valued that way when the appraisal is completed.

Now seriously...does this sound normal of a home appraiser to you? If so, then I guess I just don't need to deal with these people. .

yes, theyre generally not in the business of being followed arround and asked questions. they are there to value your house, not educate on the appraisal process/ valuation methods.

Personally, I think the guy had already done the appraisal before he ever came out here, just based off of shit online that happens to be totally incorrect on my property....and once out here it pissed him off that he might actually have to do some due diligence (or actually have to do his job). It's telling to me that when he called to setup the appt. he told my wife he'd only need to be here for 15-20 minutes....that tells me he had his number before he ever got here. .

They only take pictures and note condition while they are there. the valuation part of it is all done with online research of comps in the area when theyre done with the visit. Most on site visits are about 20 minutes. the rest of the proccess takes about 1-2 hours back at the office. he probably does 3-5 a day. The on site visit is to determine where to put your property in line with the other comparable sales in the area.

BTW - the appraisal was supposed to be $475, but since I asked his rude ass to leave after he interrupted and spoke over my wife 4-5 times, he obviously didn't complete it. The mortgage broker gave me a full refund accompanied by an apology this morning....so I'm out nothing but some frustration.

What was she asking that he kept cutting her off?

[SVT Lurch]

I'm only chiming in again because you lumped in all "these mortgage crooks"/"crooked assed lenders" and you have previously come off as a level headed poster and I understand you are(were?) upset.

Lenders today abide by the "golden rule" - he who has the gold, makes the rules. If you have other means to finance whatever it is you're trying to do, congratulations, but that does not change the guidelines if you apply for a loan. The mess that occurred after the government decided "everyone should own a home" generated much stiffer penalties so no one in the industry (at least good ones, there's always crooks in everything) is willing to gray the lines, it either fits guidelines or it does not. End of story. No ego or weight throwing, that's just how it is.

A few notes for the gallery:

• Carpet is not the only thing that keeps something from being "livable", that may have just been all in this particular case.
• Tax square footage does not necessarily equal "livable" square footage.
• Lenders like to see "nest eggs" (reserves).
• Partial value is not given for unfinished living space. In rare cases line adjustments can be made, but those are the exception, not the rule, and even in those cases you do not simply back out the missing piece(s).
• The broker in this case dropped the ball telling you it would be fine without carpet and base boards. (likely why there was a refund)
• You are borrowing liquid funds to turn your equity into cash. You can't buy groceries with equity in your house.
• Determining whether or not a refinance is worth it has more to do with the difference in your current rate compared to the new rate than just the new rate on it's own (the big factor being if you will be in the house long enough to cover the break even period).
• While the borrower pays for the appraisal, the lender is their customer, not the borrower. It does sound like the one in this case doesn't have very good people skills, but the majority of his reasons are sound as Pro88lx mentioned. Following them around asking questions is the equivalent of someone standing over your shoulder at your desk asking how and why you're doing your job.
• Appraisals are not designed to provide the true value of the house (which is what someone is willing to pay for it), they are an estimated value of what the house should sell for given recent comparables sales in the area. Most of the "custom add-ons" mentioned (while they would help sell the house) mean nothing to the appraised value (unless all the other houses have them and the subject property does not, in which case the house without them is "dinged" for the value of the upgrades).

[Pro88LX]

I'm only chiming in again because you lumped in all "these mortgage crooks"/"crooked assed lenders" and you have previously come off as a level headed poster and I understand you are(were?) upset.

Lenders today abide by the "golden rule" - he who has the gold, makes the rules. If you have other means to finance whatever it is you're trying to do, congratulations, but that does not change the guidelines if you apply for a loan. The mess that occurred after the government decided "everyone should own a home" generated much stiffer penalties so no one in the industry (at least good ones, there's always crooks in everything) is willing to gray the lines, it either fits guidelines or it does not. End of story. No ego or weight throwing, that's just how it is.

A few notes for the gallery:

• Carpet is not the only thing that keeps something from being "livable", that may have just been all in this particular case.
• Tax square footage does not necessarily equal "livable" square footage.
• Lenders like to see "nest eggs" (reserves).
• Partial value is not given for unfinished living space. In rare cases line adjustments can be made, but those are the exception, not the rule, and even in those cases you do not simply back out the missing piece(s).
• The broker in this case dropped the ball telling you it would be fine without carpet and base boards. (likely why there was a refund)
• You are borrowing liquid funds to turn your equity into cash. You can't buy groceries with equity in your house.
• Determining whether or not a refinance is worth it has more to do with the difference in your current rate compared to the new rate than just the new rate on it's own (the big factor being if you will be in the house long enough to cover the break even period).
• While the borrower pays for the appraisal, the lender is their customer, not the borrower. It does sound like the one in this case doesn't have very good people skills, but the majority of his reasons are sound as Pro88lx mentioned. Following them around asking questions is the equivalent of someone standing over your shoulder at your desk asking how and why you're doing your job.
• Appraisals are not designed to provide the true value of the house (which is what someone is willing to pay for it), they are an estimated value of what the house should sell for given recent comparables sales in the area. Most of the "custom add-ons" mentioned (while they would help sell the house) mean nothing to the appraised value (unless all the other houses have them and the subject property does not, in which case the house without them is "dinged" for the value of the upgrades).

Stop being such a dick!

[jayjohnson600]

I though the cash-out refi was still dead, as well as home equity loans.

Maybe the hunt for yield has enough power to start re-inflating the bubble.

[SVT Lurch]

Stop being such a dick!

I though the cash-out refi was still dead, as well as home equity loans.

Maybe the hunt for yield has enough power to start re-inflating the bubble.

They never died, just had (and still have) more restrictive guidelines.

[2011GT]

No need to post a dick reply Dude....just b/c you're "in the business".


I guarantee you if one of those crooked assed lenders foreclosed on a house exactly like this they'd put it on the market at full value with a notation of needing carpet on the second floor....I seriously doubt they'd forego the entire space on market price just for carpet....so why should I?

No they wouldn't because the bank wouldn't loan the money. They will only loan on the appraised amount.

[GrayStangGT]

I just want to see pictures of this badass bar and media room

[Rreemo]

Ok...it's long, but I want to tell the whole story so we can close this thread down.

So here's exactly how it went down...when the guy showed I was actually working in my office and on a conference call at the time...my wife let him in and told him to help himself and I'd be off the phone shortly. I could hear him bitching to her about how far out we lived and how awful of a drive he had to make to get here. About 10-15 minutes passed, and when I got off the phone I stepped out of my office and saw that he was taking pictures of our outside fireplace and back porch area, so I stepped out there to speak with him....when I first walked out he says he's pretty much done, but I wanted to be sure that he realized that looking online at places like Citi, Chase, Zillow, etc. all show my house at an incorrect square footage (downstairs, not even talking about the media room that's been in-question), and most of them also show that I only have 2.5 baths when we actually have 3 full baths downstairs (there is also a half bath in the media room too, but not even counting it yet)...those sites also show that I have a 3-car garage, and again that is incorrect...it is a 4-car, actually oversized at 45x28 (has two 16' doors)....whereas a standard 4-car is typically 40x20...not much, but 40sqft is worth a mention when it's garage space. Of course I also told him about the upstairs and what the broker had said.

This is where the shit kinda started....the guy immediately seems to develop an attitude...says he has to go from what is reported online for square footage regardless of what I "think it is"...then he tells me he only counted 3 bedrooms and 2 baths....so of course I corrected the guy, and asked him...did you not even go over into the area by the rear door to the garage? We have a private guest bedroom (#4) over there with a full bath...his response was that he only saw a closet door over there, and he didn't need to see the garage. I said no, that is a whole other bedroom with a full private bath...as I led him over to show him. I also figured he was going to give me shit on the square footage, so I had the blue prints for the house handy....brought him back over to the kitchen, unrolled that on the kitchen table and told him to have a look for himself...this is the real deal where sqft is concerned, regardless of what is posted online.

The guy made some notes and looked over the blueprint, then says he's going to need to take it or I'll have to make him a copy. I told him sure...no problem, I'm happy to give you a copy I actually have several on-hand. Then I told him he still needed to see the upstairs...I didn't even go up with him...I said you go up and have a look around...and I actually said "I don't want to be hovering over you while you're trying to do your job".

The guy is probably up there 3-4 minutes tops...I'm standing in the kitchen leaning on the island when he comes down, he immediately says (and I quote), "that space doesn't add any value to your home". I'm like WTF?! So I asked him, how can that be?....we're talking almost 1000 sqft with another office, 1/2 bath, and a bunch of built in electronics that are now part of the house?....and his response was "yeah 1000sqft of attic space until you finish it". I came back and stated...it just needs carpet and some base boards...his exact response was, "I don't care how little it needs, it's not part of the living space until it's 100% finished as far as I'm concerned". He very well could have stopped right there and explained his limitations and how he is held accountable, but he did not! To the contrary, the guys tone is going further and further off track by this time. I had my tablet handy, and this is when I also showed him the property a couple streets over and what it recently sold for....he got really shitty and made the statement about "I'd have to be crazy to think I'd ever get anywhere near that for this house, "especially in this area". I live in the county about 6-miles from the city limits.

The whole time my wife is keeping quiet and sitting at the breakfast table...she can tell I'm starting to get annoyed with this dicks attitude. So she steps in and says, "can I ask a question?"....his EXACT response was, "I don't know...can you?". She gave him kind of a odd look, and then starts to tell him that we are planning to build a shop....her intent at this time was to ask the guy #1 if something like a shop is similar to a pool on the appraisal...we all know a pool typically adds very little compared to what it actually costs the homeowner, is a shop like that too?....and #2 she wanted to ask his opinion (as an appraiser) if it would be in our best interest to wait on this until not just the upstairs was done, but also perhaps until after the shop was up.

The first question she's trying to ask if a shop is valued kind of like a pool...he cuts her off before she can finish, and says...pools don't add anything significant to your home value, sometimes they can even cut the value depending on the area you live in. She says, I understand that but that's not what I'm asking...at about which time he cuts her off again and says...how do you expect me to give you a value on a shop you haven't even built yet? She's starting to get frustrated now too, and says "stop!"....I'm not asking you to put a dollar amount on anything, I'm asking for your professional opinion, as someone who appraises houses....do you think it would be in our best interest to wait and do this refinance after the shop is up? That's when he says...., you just said it yourself, I appraise houses not shops....I have no idea if your shop is going to help or hurt the value of this property, and I'm not at liberty to tell you how to do your business!

It was that exact point I'd had enough....I said, "ok, you're done here!" I don't know what your problem is buddy, but you've been a disrespectful prick since you got here....you're in MY house, I'm not taking another word of it, and you are no longer welcome here...get your shit and get out...we are done!

He actually kind of looked me up & down as-if he was sizing me up and says...."well I'm not done with my appraisal yet", almost stated it like it was a question though. I immediately stepped around the counter right up to him and said, no you are completely done here and I WILL NOT tell you again, there's the door...you're down to about 2-seconds to get your sorry disrespectful ass through it and off of my property...and let me just state, if you think otherwise remember about how far you were bitching about driving out here....the closest ambulance is about 25-minutes from here...can you afford to bleed that long asshole?!

He didn't say another word...turned and very swiftly excused himself out the front door, walked real fast to his truck and quickly drove away.

I have no room for this sort of disrespect, especially in my own home....I don't care what questions he was asked, he can choose to be professional and respectful to others regardless if he chooses to answer or not, especially when it's people who are helping to put food in his mouth.

So no, I did not follow him around and look over his shoulder the whole time, but yes indeed I did feel the need to correct his incompetence....just imagine if I hadn't said a word to the guy...he'd have completed his appraisal missing an entire bedroom, a bathroom, correct size of the garage, and would have completely misstated square footage of the house.

Maybe I'm just old fashioned, but I was raised to respect someone when I am in their home, and I also have very little tolerance for anyone who pisses off or half-asses their way through their job. This guy scored an F on both.

I received several calls from the broker today, and even one from someone claiming to be his boss...all apologies and I didn't even have to ask them for the refund, they just did it. Apparently the asshole didn't deny the way it went down either, but still gave no reason for his attitude....I was told they will not be using his services in the future. Good! I hope the fucker ends up homeless and starves to death! He needs to pick a new career.

Nevertheless, I shouldn't have posted on here right after this happened yesterday....I was very pissed still, and therefore out-of-line with my reply to Pro88LX, and I'll say again Chris...I apologize, my bad. It wasn't called for and I took my frustration out inappropriately.

[UserX]

Sorry, couldn't resist

[YALE]

So you have a place I can park a travel trailer?