Looks like Matts pension plan is on hold...

[Slowhand]

He'll get his, I really don't think he has anything to worry about as well-vested as I'm assuming he is.

[sc281]

Come to work with me some day and see where your hard earned tax money goes. I'm sure a trip down short E. Lancaster or a visit to some Section 8 housing will make you fell better. I've worked a hell of a lot harder for whatever I end up getting than those that take without having ever made a contribution. I get tired of going on calls where NONE of the participants have ever held a legitimate job, but when asked if they work answer with "I gets a check"...

I get what youre saying, but what you fail to realize is an entitlement is an entitlement, whether its a gubment check or an 8% guarantted growth rate. Just different flavors of the entitlement pie.

When fort worth has to up its annual contibution fron 37million to 75million and STILL has a 918millionunfunded liability, ypu have an endemic problem that is quite frankly insurmountable without drastic measures, regardless what your union or plan admin says during your pension briefings. Its math. I know a lot of you guys work your asses off, and I dont understand why yall arent up in arms about the obviously ridiculous promises made to yall. You guys that worked in good faith are the ones who are gonna lose the most when this shit shakes itself out.

Just one cited source, more upon request.

http://www.star-telegram.com/2012/05/12/3954977/taxpayers-deserve-facts-not-spin.html

Just like our 16trillion dollar debt, it cant stay the same forever, and its gonna fuck the country up when the music stops. I REALLY hope you are putting sme of that 94k salary away as a backup. You are going to need it, i promise you that.

[Slowhand]

Unless you are a resident or business taxpayer in FTW, then you don't have much of a say.

You're absolutely right about that, unless it takes federal or state funds to bail out the pension. But the pension squeeze is also not a problem localized to FTW. It's happening in tons of municipalities across the country. It's a problem at all levels of government.

But, again, my personal involvement (or lack thereof) in the issue doesn't change the economic situation. Although I do seem to recall you participating in a multitude of threads bitching about things going on in Kommiefornia or a variety of other localities through the country. I could be wrong, but if I'm not, why involve yourself in those threads?

And as shown below, it isn't like the fund is taking any significant amount of tax income.

lmao! How do you propose the $700mm shortfall is going to be bridged, then? This shit doesn't just reverse itself overnight. In order to close that PBO, at the very least you're going to need above average returns (~2-3%+, putting the total return over 11%, lol!) for the next decade.

[littlemoney]

Something else to consider, is the City of Fort Worth used the pension plan to help get officers to the city, when other city's were offering higher salaries.

[03trubluGT]

Ain't it funny that almost without exception that the people here who get unsustainable benefits are all for it and the people who have to pay for those unsustainable benefits are all against it?

Funny how that works out.

"Those who rob Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul."

Come to work with me some day and see where your hard earned tax money goes. I'm sure a trip down short E. Lancaster or a visit to some Section 8 housing will make you fell better. I've worked a hell of a lot harder for whatever I end up getting than those that take without having ever made a contribution. I get tired of going on calls where NONE of the participants have ever held a legitimate job, but when asked if they work answer with "I gets a check"...

Is that really all you have to contribute to the conversation? This is as much an issue of the state of the economy in this country as bailouts and welfare programs are.

I don't care what other people are making with their pensions, but I do care how much my governments are spending to fund those pensions. Unfortunately, the two are directly and entirely correlated.

Unless you are a resident or business taxpayer in FTW, then you don't have much of a say. And as shown below, it isn't like the fund is taking any significant amount of tax income.

Actually with GASB, the cities are now REQUIRED to fully fund the pension plans at all times. Ft. Worth does have a good plan 8.73 paid by employee and 20% match by the city. MOST cities in Texas are members of TMRS and most of those are 7/14 plans. ALL these funds are PRIVATELY invested. TMRS is VERY solvent and their investments have done very well.
Also, most of these employees do not pay into social security. This IS their retirement plan.
Could they do better on their own ? Yes some could, with proper investment advice.
IMHO, Ft. Worth could drop back to a 7/14 plan and be competitive without issue.

With that said, I do find it funny that Henry would make a thread like this just for me, and it would have such healthy participation.

[Forever_frost]

I'd like to say "I like Pie."

[03trubluGT]

"GFY Coward" was such a devastating rebuttal that I've got egg on my face? This is really what you're saying here? lmao

See, just the typical lighthearted happy-go-lucky response when someone calls you out. You are the poster child for "can dish it out but can't take it".....

[Forever_frost]

That's all that needs to be contributed to this conversation. Don't be concerned with what Matt or me or anyone else has as far as pension benefits, because that's between employer and employee. If they are not fulfilled so be it.

Personally I prefer the 401K route to being my primary source of retirement income, but to each their own.

If only this were true. The employers are the taxpayers. If these benefits were paid for by the public servants and fully funded by them without having taxpayers on the hook for these outrageous benefits, you'd have an argument.

[Sean88gt]

Be prepared to lose a bunch of money doing that!

Oh I know.

[sc281]

All that money just rains down from the sky!

Actually, if we get another recession going this problem is going to take care of itself, you will see cities going under right and left. It is possible that we are in the early stages right now.

I fucking pray it does. This country needs to realize just how costly their free shit is.

[sc281]

Calm down and get to work securing your own retirement so you'll "get yours". Or, get all bitter about it being someone elses fault that you're not going to "get yours" and wind up with nothing. It is always someone elses fault now isn't

If your generation took your own advice and save, then we wouldnt be in ths fucking mess. But no, you squandered the wealth handed you by the wwII generation of your parents, mortgaged the next 3 generations to come after you, minimum; put us all on the hook for your utopian great society pipe dreams,turned this nation from the largest creditor nation to by far the largest debtor nation, and you expect me to be CALM about it?!Fuck you.

I am putting away for mine, despite the shithole your generation has turned this country into.

I pray that you are still alive when this shit blows up so you can give that speech to your grandchildren when they look up and ask you why your generation fucked them. Im sure it will go over just as well as it has here.

[Broncojohnny]

What about other people's obligation to pay for those bennies? Not concerned there either?

Where is that money gonna come from? How much will the people have to be taxed to supportt? Who's gonna pay for my generations bennies when all the taxes collected went to pay for yours?

Your generation straddled obligation after obligation to the back of mine with no regard to how it could be paid for and no regard to how crippling it will be, and your generation couldn't give a flyin fuck about it.

As long as yall get yours, right?

All that money just rains down from the sky!

Actually, if we get another recession going this problem is going to take care of itself, you will see cities going under right and left. It is possible that we are in the early stages right now.

[The King]

What about other people's obligation to pay for those bennies? Not concerned there either?

Where is that money gonna come from? How much will the people have to be taxed to supportt? Who's gonna pay for my generations bennies when all the taxes collected went to pay for yours?

Your generation straddled obligation after obligation to the back of mine with no regard to how it could be paid for and no regard to how crippling it will be, and your generation couldn't give a flyin fuck about it.

As long as yall get yours, right?

Calm down and get to work securing your own retirement so you'll "get yours". Or, get all bitter about it being someone elses fault that you're not going to "get yours" and wind up with nothing. It is always someone elses fault now isn't it?

[Broncojohnny]

Actually with GASB, the cities are now REQUIRED to fully fund the pension plans at all times. Ft. Worth does have a good plan 8.73 paid by employee and 20% match by the city. MOST cities in Texas are members of TMRS and most of those are 7/14 plans. ALL these funds are PRIVATELY invested. TMRS is VERY solvent and their investments have done very well.
Also, most of these employees do not pay into social security. This IS their retirement plan.
Could they do better on their own ? Yes some could, with proper investment advice.
IMHO, Ft. Worth could drop back to a 7/14 plan and be competitive without issue.

"Fully fund" is meaningless because it still depends on an assumption of what return they will get on their contributions.

I have decided to retire with $4 billion in the bank and my plan is fully funded. Now I just need to get a 178% return every year for the next 40 years....

[Broncojohnny]

Don't be concerned with what Matt or me or anyone else has as far as pension benefits, because that's between employer and employee. If they are not fulfilled so be it.

I totally agree, can you stop local government from asking for me to bail them out with federal money? Same goes for private industry. Until that happens it is every taxpayer's business what is going on in these plans.