CHL Discussion thread

[BMCSean]

Taking a couple classes is not the same as training. In any of these cases, military/athletes/etc, they are not just taking classes. They are devoting large amounts of time and energy to prepare themselves for when the moment comes. I have forgotten more "cool moves" than the average person will probably ever see, I still remember the basics and what I trained the most.

Jeremy and Ben, take the classes if you want but unless you are practicing what you learn every few days you will not be proficient. The heat of the moment does throw out much of the "tactics", once the rounds start cranking off it is fight or flight and accuracy by volume for almost all people.

[GeorgeG.]

damn it...I'm almost jealous of not receiving the same type of backlash for a post I made about similar classes.

A lot of you experienced guys brought up excellent points and it all makes sense to me. However, the way I view these classes is, at a minimum, the ability to shoot in different positions and without the "1 shot/sec" crap. I've been to the range a few times, probably send off 100 rounds at varying distances and that's it. I can't say that I've really taken anything away from that day other than being two boxes lighter. Wouldn't some type of classes that take you out of the normal "pick up gun from shelf, stand, point, shoot" offer some benefits?

[Cobraman]

damn it...I'm almost jealous of not receiving the same type of backlash for a post I made about similar classes.

A lot of you experienced guys brought up excellent points and it all makes sense to me. However, the way I view these classes is, at a minimum, the ability to shoot in different positions and without the "1 shot/sec" crap. I've been to the range a few times, probably send off 100 rounds at varying distances and that's it. I can't say that I've really taken anything away from that day other than being two boxes lighter. Wouldn't some type of classes that take you out of the normal "pick up gun from shelf, stand, point, shoot" offer some benefits?

There are definetly some things you can do at any range: take a target with multiple bullseyes or targets that are numbered, start from the low ready and have a buddy call a number, bring the gun to the target fire, then go back to the low ready and repeat. Try hanging the target sideways to get more spread, and using targets with numbers and letters. This may not seem like much but as soon as you get up to speed your actual ability will start to show its ass, especially at distance. This will help the second part of your draw, and getting a solid first shot on target.

Second, which is something I do all the time but I never see anyone doing is malfunctions. Pick up some of your empty brass and let a buddy load your mag with five rounds: one of which being the empty brass. Then practice clearing it. With the general consensus of this board maybe malfuntions dont matter, but at the very least it gives you a distracter to accuracy. Now combine the two drills together.

Anything you can do at the range to complicate and break the point and shoot routine. Once you start having to think harder and worry about variables it will increase your accuracy and awareness. I've never seen anyone at any range that wasn't shooting with me doing drills like this- it pains me to see people just pointlessly wasting ammo into paper.

[Roscoe]

LOL, this is who I'd model myself after.....

[Moose242]

I fear that we will soon have Probie Grebner up in this bitch.

[KBScobravert]

Don't feed your gun spent brass unless you just hate it. Don't be cheap. Get some snap caps. Have a friend load mags with varying number of rounds and varying number of malfunctions. Practice coming from concealed for 1-3 rounds, re holster and repeat with your mags loaded for failure drills etc. This will aid in muscle memory. But like said before unless you do this for a living and practice all the time, these are perishable skill.

If I take a 'class' it is only to give me the experience and enjoyment of shooting at a different level than I normally do. Also lets me know where my limitations are.

Don't be disillusioned in thinking you are a ninja and these tactical do dads will be the primary reason you stay alive in a gun fight more than the other guy. It is an 'any given Sunday' situation and who has the gun out first.

[Probie]

I fear that we will soon have Probie Grebner up in this bitch.

Nah, I think I'll be alright

[Pokulski-Blatz]

Nah, I think I'll be alright

I am willing to bet that is what Tex Grebner thought too.

[Cobraman]

Don't feed your gun spent brass unless you just hate it. Don't be cheap. Get some snap caps.

It is a glock, of course I hate it. I just hatefuck it with empty brass and it begs for more.

[Pokulski-Blatz]

Second, which is something I do all the time but I never see anyone doing is malfunctions. Pick up some of your empty brass and let a buddy load your mag with five rounds: one of which being the empty brass. Then practice clearing it.

See, this is what we are talking about. You aren't even experienced enough to know that loading empty brass in a mag will fuck up your gun. Say goodbye to a nice looking and functional feed ramp. If you two want to go take some classes, fine. But I would focus on becoming better shooters at the very basic level before you work on advanced shooting. There are places you can shoot that will help you become a better shooter, IDPA or the like would be a good place to work on live fire holster work, drawing at home and dry fire practice is the best way to work on getting the gun on target faster, find a range that allows double taps (Shooters club, a suite at Shoot Smart)

After you work on all of that for several years then take an advanced class. By that point you might have found a place that will allow you to practice how you like.

What we are all getting at is a 20 year old kid has no business taking an advanced pistol course. He needs to spend his time working on the basics before taking it to the next step.

[Cobraman]

See, this is what we are talking about. You aren't even experienced enough to know that loading empty brass in a mag will fuck up your gun. Say goodbye to a nice looking and functional feed ramp. If you two want to go take some classes, fine. But I would focus on becoming better shooters at the very basic level before you work on advanced shooting. There are places you can shoot that will help you become a better shooter, IDPA or the like would be a good place to work on live fire holster work, drawing at home and dry fire practice is the best way to work on getting the gun on target faster, find a range that allows double taps (Shooters club, a suite at Shoot Smart)

After you work on all of that for several years then take an advanced class. By that point you might have found a place that will allow you to practice how you like.

What we are all getting at is a 20 year old kid has no business taking an advanced pistol course. He needs to spend his time working on the basics before taking it to the next step.

Lol, you are totally wrong! How is a soft piece of brass going to fuck up a hardened steel feed ramp? Why don't you do a little research before you call a 20 year old out on something I guess you don't know dick about. Look on any popular forum or shooting website: everyone says the same thing. I've done it hundreds if not thousands of times and the feed ramps on both guns look brand new. If you don't believe me, look it up....

[Pokulski-Blatz]

Lol, you are totally wrong! How is a soft piece of brass going to fuck up a hardened steel feed ramp? Why don't you do a little research before you call a 20 year old out on something I guess you don't know dick about. Look on any popular forum or shooting website: everyone says the same thing. I've done it hundreds if not thousands of times and the feed ramps on both guns look brand new. If you don't believe me, look it up....

OK. The internet says I am wrong, so clearly seeing it happen to a gun means nothing.

Edit: An empty case wont feed in a Glock so I dont know how you are pulling off "thousands of times".

[Cobraman]

OK. The internet says I am wrong, so clearly seeing it happen to a gun means nothing.

Let's see proof of it then? Because that's bullshit.

[Cobraman]

Edit: An empty case wont feed in a Glock so I dont know how you are pulling off "thousands of times".

LOL you are fucking stupid! sure it won't feed sometimes, but it feeds just fine most of the time. Why don't you try it? better yet, how about I make you a video?

[Pokulski-Blatz]

LOL you are fucking stupid! sure it won't feed sometimes, but it feeds just fine most of the time. Why don't you try it? better yet, how about I make you a video?

I just took photos of my Glock 27 jamming 4 out of 4 times. Three out of four the brass nosedived into the feed ramp, the fourth time it chambered but required me beating the piss out of the slide to get it to extract.

Before sending the slide into battery.


Same malfunction I got on 3 out of the 4


Damage to the brass