Texas Law Shield - Gun Laws

[turbopaez]

Well this was the first time ever shooting some one and felt like shit the whole day thinking I might get in trouble. The guy was shot 3 times. 1 in the arm, 1 in the chest and 1 in the leg. It was all over the news. He was in critical condition all that day and news cast and police didnt think he was going to make it. I shout him with a xds 45 and as if today they still have my weapon.

[CJ]

Well this was the first time ever shooting some one and felt like shit the whole day thinking I might get in trouble. The guy was shot 3 times. 1 in the arm, 1 in the chest and 1 in the leg. It was all over the news. He was in critical condition all that day and news cast and police didnt think he was going to make it. I shout him with a xds 45 and as if today they still have my weapon.

That is nuts.

[Pokulski-Blatz]

That's not so on the pay question.

Glassdoor.com

I lump that question in with asking someone who deployed "did you kill people". Taking a life is tough on a person. Shit, even getting close to taking a life can fuck with someones mind for a while.

[LANTIRN]

Well this was the first time ever shooting some one and felt like shit the whole day thinking I might get in trouble. The guy was shot 3 times. 1 in the arm, 1 in the chest and 1 in the leg. It was all over the news. He was in critical condition all that day and news cast and police didnt think he was going to make it. I shout him with a xds 45 and as if today they still have my weapon.

Since you don't seem to mind answering questions, what have the cops and or lawyer said about the shoot? Can you go over what happened immediatley after the incident? What were the cop's reactions? How did they treat you? Were you taken into custody? Is there any eta on how long before they decide if charges will be pressed? If you don't want to go into it more I understand, though.

[Gasser64]

I didnt read all of it but

It sucks that a cop can mail in a letter about why he thinks youre unfit to have a CHL.

THIS IS WITHOUT ANY CRIME

This will prompt an investigation into you, regarding your CHL. Whether or not they will do it may be a different story but it certainly casts a negative light on you. More than one letter and im sure theyd yank it

[Chili]

I skipped a couple, but here is one I got today:

Texas Law Shield
May 7, 2014
Texas Law Shield
From Texas Law Shield Program Attorneys
When Are Police Required To Read Me My Rights?

Dear Texas Members,

Make sure you know how to invoke your legal rights if you ever need to! Understanding how to invoke these legal rights to remain silent and to have an attorney present during any police interrogation may be vital in keeping you out of trouble with the legal system.

In this short 1-minute video, Senior Firearms Program Attorney Richard Carter explains when police are legally required to read you your Miranda Warnings, (surprise, it doesn’t necessarily work the way we see in the movies) as well as the importance of unequivocally invoking your legal rights.

[Chili]

I can see how you'd feel that way, however there's potential value-added from hearing someones first hand experience in regards to a shoot. That's not so on the pay question.

Glassdoor.com

I lump that question in with asking someone who deployed "did you kill people". Taking a life is tough on a person. Shit, even getting close to taking a life can fuck with someones mind for a while.

I must have missed these posts when the came up but... I think there is a lot of value in people sharing their personal defense stories, but can certainly understand those that may not be comfortable discussing them. Especially on a message board.

Our CHL instructor had a very significant personal experience with a shooting case that he shared in class, that really taught me a lot. Besides having a law degree and being a US Marshall for 10+ years, he actually shot and killed a guy that attempted to rob him, before even getting into law enforcement. He had to go through the grand jury process (no billed) and the civil process, and racked up significant legal bills, and his insight into the process from the "shooter's" perspective (especially being able to tie it in after the fact with his LE career) was invaluable. Worth far more than the cost of the CHL class by itself, in my mind.

But yeah, that kind of traumatic experience can be difficult for some to want to discuss, or even think about, for that matter.

I would never ask or probe someone on it, just because I would not want to put them in that situation. But if they were willing to volunteer the information, I would listen with all of my attention.

[Chili]

I may have missed a couple, but here is one from a couple days ago:

Dear Texas Members,

In this newsletter, we are going to rejoice in "silence" and the right to remain the same. Why do you invoke the right to remain silent? Why invoke your right not to be questioned without your lawyer present? In a nutshell, the answer to this question is: What you say and do is evidence, what your attorney says is not.

I just used my gun...What do I do?

“If I have done nothing wrong, why would I not just want to tell the officers what happened? Only criminals remain silent and talk through their attorneys, right? Lawyers only want my money and do nothing for me, and I was the victim.”

These are all perfectly normal human reactions, especially from those who are personally unacquainted with the criminal justice system. However, anytime someone is under scrutiny from the criminal justice system, by very definition, their freedom and fortune may be at risk. Their right to remain silent could be an integral part of their legal well-being.

You must first realize that any time a firearm is involved in an incident, whether it is fired or not, the police will very likely start with the assumption that a crime has been committed and proceed to process the evidence as such. The police will secure the area, interview witnesses, and look for physical evidence. If your actions are the focus of the investigation, any statement you make will either corroborate what the witnesses and physical evidence show, or it will not. There may be shell casings, ballistics trajectories and/or possibly even video or photographic evidence. If your statement does not perfectly match the evidence, even to the slightest degree, your version of the facts could be viewed differently than you would like and will likely be used against you. If you make no statements concerning the facts of the incident until you speak to your attorney, you eliminate the possibility of allowing an inconsistency, no matter how innocent, to be used against you.

Some of you reading this might be thinking, "That is all very good advice, but this won't happen to me." Well, unfortunately, it can. In one past case under our program, a member who had never been in any trouble with the law was forced to use his gun. Unfortunately, our member, even though he was experiencing massive stress and pressure because he had to fire his gun, gave a statement to the police without consulting us first. The statement included several very specific facts that could not be immediately corroborated by the officer. The result was that this inconsistency resulted in a criminal charge. The lesson here is, after a shooting, speak to your attorneys before giving a statement to law enforcement!

There is a very simple reason for this - talking cannot help when you are under police investigation. Very few people ever talk themselves out of being arrested. However, many people have talked themselves into jail. Your statements may be completely innocent, but if they conflict in any way with other evidence in the case, even if that evidence is mistaken, mischaracterized, or just plain wrong, you will have a legal issue.

Remember, that if you are involved in a situation where you were forced to use your firearm, you will not be in a proper state of mind to accurately give the police all the facts and only the facts. You may forget an important detail, overstate the situation, say something that cannot be corroborated, or in a worst case scenario, say something that can be proven to be false.

[Tyrone Biggums]

Thanks for sharing these, Craig. We took our chl class today and a rep for TLS came in and talked for about 10 minutes. I wanted to do a little research up front before signing on. Normally I would laugh at the thought of a pre-paid legal service, but in this case, I'm having a hard time finding a reason not to do it.

[GhostTX]

So...any more people get this? And how's it been? I'm still mulling around this, USCCA, or other options. Do feel it'd be good "protection", just trying to find the best value.

[Cobraman]

So...any more people get this? And how's it been? I'm still mulling around this, USCCA, or other options. Do feel it'd be good "protection", just trying to find the best value.

I've had it for around a year now. It is only a few bucks a month and is just kind of out of sight out of mind until they send you an info email. I can't really say it is good or bad- but the guy that shot someone in this thread said they are helping out. That's good enough for me.

[Semper299]

Most police officers carry some type of pre paid legal service so yeah, if you are going to carry I would recommend it.

[Cobraman]

I've said before that If I ever get into a situation where I need them and they don't do shit, I'm not really in any different situation than I would have been anyways. A few bucks a month is as easy as skipping whataburger one time, and then you at least have a game plan for when shtf. Who would you call after the police currently? I'd hate to be searching google for a 2nd amendment attorney day of. Worst case you are out like $80 a year, best case they save you thousands.

[Gasser64]

I've said before that If I ever get into a situation where I need them and they don't do shit, I'm not really in any different situation than I would have been anyways. A few bucks a month is as easy as skipping whataburger one time, and then you at least have a game plan for when shtf. Who would you call after the police currently? I'd hate to be searching google for a 2nd amendment attorney day of. Worst case you are out like $80 a year, best case they save you thousands.

For this reason i will buy it. But i would like to see some people they have helped.

[Chili]

When they made the pitch they gave examples of how they have saved clients from jail and costly legal expenses, but of course that is the point of marketing.

But, as others have mentioned, for the somewhat nominal cost, I feel much better with it. I have mentioned this story before, but our CHL instructor was involved in a fatal shooting before he went into law enforcement (attempted robbery at gunpoint at a gas station). This was before the "stand your ground" laws and when asked if he could have retreated he sarcastically said he could have. Little did he know, the buddy buddy act of the cop in charge fooled him into thinking he was in no danger, but they then used that against him as a basis for prosecution.

He beat the criminal and civil cases but spent 10's of thousands of dollars on each (in the 90's).

My two main take-aways were: Don't talk to cops after a shooting and mitigate potential for out-of-control legal costs.