Street robberies and you - The Basics

[DON SVO]

How do you guys handle the crazy fucks that don't care if you have a gun.
I have seen 2 situations where the aggressor didn't give a shit.
First one the aggressor was like, what are you going to do with that, shoot me, etc.
Second situation, the aggressor "dared" me to draw.

Well of course they did... Most street thugs know white people with guns are CHL holders. They can run their mouth because you can't shoot a piece of shit for flapping his crack-suckers. But they also know the jig is up. They will just wait to rob someone else.

Tyler, if you have a situation that has escalated to the point you are willing to pull your CCW you need to be ready to go. If Shitavius has created a situation where you've become self-aware enough to have it out and ready, it's go time. If someone is threatening enough to draw and AIM, you've made it evidently clear prior to this action that they need to slow their roll, and now they're going to hit the brakes or hit the pavement in a quivering heap of blood-gurgling welfare-relieving chest sucking death.

What I'm trying to get at is if they KNOW you have a CCW you've either been put into a position where their next decision decided the outcome, or you're flash-happy.

I have no problem (drives the GF nuts sometimes) of placing my hand on the butt end of my CCW when I spot something amiss. I never have drawn and aimed, but I'm ready to take on all-comers. If Shitavius is mocking you for brandishing, he's not gonna do anything else. A street thug looking to rob you or start some shit wants surprise and overwhelming violence to be his Trump card. Like I said in my other post... Run your mouth, flip me off, call my dead mom a whore. I don't care. Talk won't kill me or take my wallet or rape my girlfriend. If they're just talking... Even the "go 'head and shoot me" bullshit... They're just talking and they KNOW that surprise is GONE and the violence might be upped a bit more than they're wanting to deal with tonight.

[DON SVO]

Did he have a weapon?

Does it matter?

[Steve]

Does it matter?

Depends on the situation.

[DON SVO]

Depends on the situation.

To me, not really. The last thing someone with a CHL and a CCW wants to do is risk letting that distance get closed on an assumption that the BG is unarmed. I'm not going to trust some fool to tell me the truth and I don't care to find out. If I ever pull on someone in earnest it will be because they have given me enough reason to doubt their intentions... so no way in hell will I trust them if they say "I ain't got nuthin".

I know for a fact I would lie.

[Steve]

To me, not really. The last thing someone with a CHL and a CCW wants to do is risk letting that distance get closed on an assumption that the BG is unarmed. I'm not going to trust some fool to tell me the truth and I don't care to find out. If I ever pull on someone in earnest it will be because they have given me enough reason to doubt their intentions... so no way in hell will I trust them if they say "I ain't got nuthin".

I know for a fact I would lie.

I'm not expecting anyone to ask their adversary if they are armed or not. Chances are on a situation like the one above it would be obvious by the time the other guy was getting out of his car and heading to the other one if his hands are empty or not.

In my opinion, taking part in a road rage incident is not an ideal situation to pull a weapon on an unarmed person if both parties are taking part in it. Now, if one driver forces the other to the side of the road rather than both parties just deciding to stop to throwdown that is another thing entirely.

The tricky thing about carrying a weapon is that it becomes tricky and unsafe to go hands on in risk of your adversary obtaining your own weapon. Some situations can be handled without having to pull a weapon. If one is feeling the need to hip check themselves on a regular basis I think the reason why they are carrying maybe need to be revisited.

[Fatass]

An interesting read to say the least.

My own personal experience...

I was driving on 423 through the colony twords 121 when i notice a truck in my mirror tailgating the car behind me, we make the turn onto 121 and i take the middle lane and he takes the left, next thing I see is this asshole swerving at me. I try to take off, hyundai elantra isn't the quickest thing on the road. Fast forward, he does it two more times, we hit a red light. I stop behind the car in front of me like normal, he stops 4-5 cars short of the next car in front of him, right next to me. He starts to roll his passenger window down, I pull my 1911 out of the glovebox and have it in hand, girlfriend calls the cops and tells them what's going on and that there is a pistol in the car. Douchebag does the same. He tells them I drew down on him, cops arrive, put me in cuffs, rip my car apart, tell my girlfriend she's going to jail as she was there and continue to ask where the drugs are. I'm not clean cut, I maintain a beard, my ears are pierced and i typically wear shorts and a tshirt. They release my car to her after an hour of being cuffed on the side of 121 and charge me with deadly conduct. Long story short I did a year probation for disorderly conduct because I couldn't risk a jury trial and 6 months in prison. Cops are fucking screwy, I have zero respect for 99% of them anymore and my grandfather was one for 20 years. He felt the same way about the new line of robocops.

[Machx2]

I don't get many people messing with me. Of course there are the bad drivers. But I think alot has to do with how you look and dress. Most victims that I encounter, look like someone anyone would consider an easy target. I usually wear Army shirts or some sort of gun advertisement shirt that I get free when making orders at certain places (I am a cheap ass) I don't know if this helps me, who knows maybe I just scream cop when I am walking around.

[DON SVO]

I'm not expecting anyone to ask their adversary if they are armed or not. Chances are on a situation like the one above it would be obvious by the time the other guy was getting out of his car and heading to the other one if his hands are empty or not.

In my opinion, taking part in a road rage incident is not an ideal situation to pull a weapon on an unarmed person if both parties are taking part in it. Now, if one driver forces the other to the side of the road rather than both parties just deciding to stop to throwdown that is another thing entirely.

The tricky thing about carrying a weapon is that it becomes tricky and unsafe to go hands on in risk of your adversary obtaining your own weapon. Some situations can be handled without having to pull a weapon. If one is feeling the need to hip check themselves on a regular basis I think the reason why they are carrying maybe need to be revisited.

Steve, I just don't plan on getting into fist fights anymore

Road rage-oriented CCW pulls/exposures are something I don't quite understand. I've heard lots of stories in that vein, my opinion is that a lot of those occurences could easily have been avoided by simply pulling into a parking lot or exiting. If you're stuck in a situation where you feel your CCW needs to come into view, I would have to be in a situation where I would willingly draw on someone in plain view. Telling a cop, "he followed me over multiple lanes, chased me through a few lights, followed me into my neighborhood so I called 911 and headed for a 7-11, he followed me there, I parked and had my CCW out in my lap, he came running up to my car, I brandished it and he ran and called 911 from his own vehicle" is going to be a situation where you've already alerted authorities and finally exposed/drew on someone when you were cornered and felt a potentially deadly assault was about to take place. In Fatass' story, he pulled on a guy in his car when the other dude pulled up next to him and rolled down his window... I don't think that constitutes any sort of assault or real threat, if the other guy isn't armed you're stuck.

Cars have liscense plates and distinguishing characteristics that would make it very easy for some pissed off Yuppie to call you in for brandishing over some swerving and cutting someone off.

[ceyko]

Primary reason I went with an LCP is because I figured anytime I would need my gun would be up close...probably real close. Still can hit fairly far out with too. Plus it can easily be carried in dress slacks which is a big plus to me.

[mikec]

I'm not expecting anyone to ask their adversary if they are armed or not. Chances are on a situation like the one above it would be obvious by the time the other guy was getting out of his car and heading to the other one if his hands are empty or not.

In my opinion, taking part in a road rage incident is not an ideal situation to pull a weapon on an unarmed person if both parties are taking part in it. Now, if one driver forces the other to the side of the road rather than both parties just deciding to stop to throwdown that is another thing entirely.

The tricky thing about carrying a weapon is that it becomes tricky and unsafe to go hands on in risk of your adversary obtaining your own weapon. Some situations can be handled without having to pull a weapon. If one is feeling the need to hip check themselves on a regular basis I think the reason why they are carrying maybe need to be revisited.

Why am I not surprised that you would question me?

lol Your issues toward me will never go away...


And it was 11pm, the guy was a hood rat, and I didn't ask him if he was armed. He was charging me, and I'm not much of a fighter. If he's an armbar champion like you, does it matter if he has a gun or knife or bat or...

[Steve]

Steve, I just don't plan on getting into fist fights anymore

Road rage-oriented CCW pulls/exposures are something I don't quite understand. I've heard lots of stories in that vein, my opinion is that a lot of those occurences could easily have been avoided by simply pulling into a parking lot or exiting. If you're stuck in a situation where you feel your CCW needs to come into view, I would have to be in a situation where I would willingly draw on someone in plain view. Telling a cop, "he followed me over multiple lanes, chased me through a few lights, followed me into my neighborhood so I called 911 and headed for a 7-11, he followed me there, I parked and had my CCW out in my lap, he came running up to my car, I brandished it and he ran and called 911 from his own vehicle" is going to be a situation where you've already alerted authorities and finally exposed/drew on someone when you were cornered and felt a potentially deadly assault was about to take place. In Fatass' story, he pulled on a guy in his car when the other dude pulled up next to him and rolled down his window... I don't think that constitutes any sort of assault or real threat, if the other guy isn't armed you're stuck.

Cars have liscense plates and distinguishing characteristics that would make it very easy for some pissed off Yuppie to call you in for brandishing over some swerving and cutting someone off.

Yep, I agree. It's a tricky situation.

Why am I not surprised that you would question me?

lol Your issues toward me will never go away...


And it was 11pm, the guy was a hood rat, and I didn't ask him if he was armed. He was charging me, and I'm not much of a fighter. If he's an armbar champion like you, does it matter if he has a gun or knife or bat or...

We don't have any issues bro. I wasn't there, so of course I'm going to ask questions. I have no alterior motives when asking you questions. You can relax and drop the satire. I'm simply trying to understand the situation. The idea of carrying a weapon is an odd but interesting to me idea. My background and experience with firearms is MUCH different than you fellas here in Texas. The attitude in regards to firearms here vastly different as well.

Back home, it's a very taboo thing, having a weapon like that just got you in bad places with bad people. Yes, I realize I'm not in "Commiefornia", but that still doesn't get rid of that bad vibe feeling that has been engrained in me when I get around them due to numerous bad experiences. I'm trying to get comfortable with it which in part comes with asking questions to people who are comfortable with them.

Your road rage incident is something I feel that I could relate to in a situation I could possibly find myself in. My personal conflict I feel about it, as that in certain situations, I feel that I'm able to handle certain situations and people without escalating it further than necessary and I almost feel obligated to handle it with the minimum force needed. Just typing that, I know how ridiculous that will sound to some of you guys having compassion for someone who is clearly set on causing me harm. But due to firsthand experience seeing the loss of lives due to gun play, I have a high regard for human life and I sure in the hell don't want to go to prison.

I'm simply trying to understand here in order to make the right decision because this is a big one for me that covers a personal thing. Am I right for carrying? Is my hesitation a good thing or bad thing? I could see that going both ways. At home, I have no issues with it all. Come through a window or the door when you shouldn't, time to get blasted with a shotgun. There is no grey area in that situation. Outside of the home is a different thing that makes me very cautious.

I hope you accept my explantion.

[GeorgeG.]

sheesh, I need to find a holster that fits me well so I can carry more often. my problem is I don't typically like over sized shirts or pants. I can fit my .380 in the front pocket of most of my pants but I'd prefer to carry the .45.

Unfortunately, my current job prohibits it as well and Bernie's post just confirmed it.

[DON SVO]

I'm simply trying to understand here in order to make the right decision because this is a big one for me that covers a personal thing. Am I right for carrying? Is my hesitation a good thing or bad thing? I could see that going both ways. At home, I have no issues with it all. Come through a window or the door when you shouldn't, time to get blasted with a shotgun. There is no grey area in that situation. Outside of the home is a different thing that makes me very cautious.

I hope you accept my explantion.

Well, here's what I hope makes sense for you because that's a pretty valid concern.

In Texas, Castle Doctrine enables you to rightfully protect your person, property and family with the use of deadly force if warranted. There's a lot of legal jargon that I'm not going to post up (it's already been done), but it pretty well covers you and protects you from civil liability on a good shoot. So there's that.

A CHL is not specifically an extension of Castle Doctrine. What a CHL basically does is legally allow you to conceal a carry weapon in order to protect yourself at all times (emphasis on LEGALLY). If you shoot someone over a parking spot, or get caught carrying a weapon where it's restricted, or shoot your own self because you're a moron the CHL won't help you. What it WILL do is prevent you from being caught somewhere without a way to save yourself (should it come to that). If you get stuck and accosted by multiple assailants and one is armed, no amount of badassery will save you. Give them your wallet, your watch, your car keys and HOPE the thug is telling the truth when he says he won't kill you or go to your house and rob you or rape your wife etc.

If you attend a good CHL class, it will outline for you when you are justified in using lethal force. It'll teach you what to do if you DO have to shoot someone. A perfect world dictates that I won't get robbed or assaulted or murdered, and that I would NEVER need to have a firearm. In reality I would prefer to have the option. It's definitely a personal choice with consequences (good and bad) going with either carrying or not. I am a fan of the former.

[DON SVO]

sheesh, I need to find a holster that fits me well so I can carry more often. my problem is I don't typically like over sized shirts or pants. I can fit my .380 in the front pocket of most of my pants but I'd prefer to carry the .45.

Unfortunately, my current job prohibits it as well and Bernie's post just confirmed it.

Bernie's post just stated the language the PREVENTS your employer from prohibiting weapons on premises. You can carry in your car.

[GeorgeG.]

.......Texas passed this law last year, Added by Acts 2011, 82nd Leg., R.S., Ch. 1058, Sec. 1, eff. September 1, 2011.:

Sec. 52.061. RESTRICTION ON PROHIBITING EMPLOYEE ACCESS TO OR STORAGE OF FIREARM OR AMMUNITION. A public or private employer may not prohibit an employee who holds a license to carry a concealed handgun under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, who otherwise lawfully possesses a firearm, or who lawfully possesses ammunition from transporting or storing a firearm or ammunition the employee is authorized by law to possess in a locked, privately owned motor vehicle in a parking lot, parking garage, or other parking area the employer provides for employees.

There's all this other language too:

Sec. 52.062. EXCEPTIONS. (a) Section 52.061 does not:
(1) authorize a person who holds a license to carry a concealed handgun under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, who otherwise lawfully possesses a firearm, or who lawfully possesses ammunition to possess a firearm or ammunition on any property where the possession of a firearm or ammunition is prohibited by state or federal law; or
(2) apply to:
(A) a vehicle owned or leased by a public or private employer and used by an employee in the course and scope of the employee's employment, unless the employee is required to transport or store a firearm in the official discharge of the employee's duties;
(B) a school district;
(C) an open-enrollment charter school, as defined by Section 5.001, Education Code;(D) a private school, as defined by Section 22.081, Education Code;
....

So am I reading this wrong? I work for a charter school system. I know when visiting my kids' school, I can leave it in the car, but reading this tells me that if I work for a school, I can't.