Buy a handgun in TX for PA resident?

[ceyko]

My Dad has wanted a true pocket gun for awhile. I was going to buy him an LCP once at Cabelas, but they freaked when I told them.

PA is pretty loose gun wise. I THOUGHT I could just buy it here in TX, give it to him and he could check it as normal with the flight back.

I can't find any specific information on this, does anyone have any links? I am going to look into FFL transfers, but it would be really nice to simply give it to him and he can do what he wants with it then. (While he is in state-TX)

Appreciate it.

[ceyko]

I also posted this on a PA firearms forum. If anyone is interested, I will post up the answer if I find it - if not answered here.

If I have to do an FFL transfer, do I contact a TX FFL or a PA FFL? Never had to do one.

[John -- '02 HAWK]

As a gift it doesn't have to go through an ffl, its the same as a private sell. What you are doing walks a fine line between legitimacy and a being an illegal straw purchase.

Yes you can fly with it and thats been covered on here

[helosailor]

It's a bit of a tricky situation, and getting a dealer to understand can be tough. The way the ATF is, most are afraid that they'll end up in prison if they forget to cross a ""t".
According to the ATF http://www.atf.gov/publications/down...f-p-5300-4.pdf, on page 165, middle column...if you are the purchaser and the item is intended as gift (with no exchange of money taking place between you and the recipient), then you can legally complete the 4473 as the actual purchaser.
In other words, if the recipient is legally allowed to own said firearm, then it is completely legal and you do not have to make any statement regarding who the recipient of the firearm will be.

[ceyko]

As a gift it doesn't have to go through an ffl, its the same as a private sell. What you are doing walks a fine line between legitimacy and a being an illegal straw purchase.

Yes you can fly with it and thats been covered on here

Yup, flying for this is the easy one and is fairly straight forward. Appreciate it.

It's a bit of a tricky situation, and getting a dealer to understand can be tough. The way the ATF is, most are afraid that they'll end up in prison if they forget to cross a ""t".
According to the ATF http://www.atf.gov/publications/down...f-p-5300-4.pdf, on page 165, middle column...if you are the purchaser and the item is intended as gift (with no exchange of money taking place between you and the recipient), then you can legally complete the 4473 as the actual purchaser.
In other words, if the recipient is legally allowed to own said firearm, then it is completely legal and you do not have to make any statement regarding who the recipient of the firearm will be.

Holy heck, how did you know to look there? I read that and it seems fairly straight forward. I think I do need to get a grasp of PA laws. I know they are fairly loose, but for handguns may require it be registered in his name. In that case, I may just give him the money and have him go through the process to be on the safe side. Takes away from the whole spirit of the thing, but him getting arrested would as well.

Thanks for the advice and references.

[ThreeFingerPete]

Buy it, give it to him. Finished.

[ceyko]

Concur at this point actually. PA nor TX requires any registration of these type of weapons. It seems 100% hassle free to do this sort of thing for these 2 states. Based off the straw purchase law/wording, we're doing nothing incorrectly or illegal.

Appreciate the response on this side of the fence. Nothing from the PA forums.

[livetoshoot]

An individual can not purchase or receive a firearm from an individual from another state. To do this legally it must be sent to a licensed dealer in the acquiring persons state, in this case PA.


A person may sell a firearm to an unlicensed resident of his State, if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law. A person may loan or rent a firearm to a resident of any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes, if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law. A person may sell or transfer a firearm to a licensee in any State. However, a firearm other than a curio or relic may not be transferred interstate to a licensed collector.

[18 U.S.C. 922(a)(3) and (5), 922(d), 27 CFR 478.29 and 478.30]

A person may only acquire a firearm within the person’s own State, except that he or she may purchase or otherwise acquire a rifle or shotgun, in person, at a licensee’s premises in any State, provided the sale complies with State laws applicable in the State of sale and the State where the purchaser resides. A person may borrow or rent a firearm in any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes.

[18 U.S.C. 922(a)(3) and (5), 922(b)(3), 27 CFR 478.29 and 478.30]

person not licensed under the GCA and not prohibited from acquiring firearms may purchase a firearm from an out-of-State source and obtain the firearm if an arrangement is made with a licensed dealer in the purchaser’s State of residence for the purchaser to obtain the firearm from the dealer.

[18 U.S.C. 922(a)(3) and 922(b)(3)]

[svauto-erotic855]

Crossing state lines to transfer a hand gun is completely illegal without doing it through an FFL. That being said keep your damn mouth shut when you buy it and hand it to your dad. Even better would be buying one via a private party sale from one of the local forums.

[ceyko]

Jesus. That information seems straightforward that livetoshoot posted. I hear what you're saying svo855, but I guess I'll just do the FFL transfer to stay on the straight and narrow with it.

Thanks again everyone. I think I could get away with it, but 15-30 dollars for the transfer would seem like money well spent - to be safe about it.

[CJ]

I'm in a little late, but PA is a state when you can't transfer to without 2 FFL's involved.

[CJ]

Crossing state lines to transfer a hand gun is completely illegal without doing it through an FFL. That being said keep your damn mouth shut when you buy it and hand it to your dad. Even better would be buying one via a private party sale from one of the local forums.

That would be an interstate straw purchase, a double no-no.

[YALE]

As a gift it doesn't have to go through an ffl, its the same as a private sell. What you are doing walks a fine line between legitimacy and a being an illegal straw purchase.

Yes you can fly with it and thats been covered on here

Negative. All handgun transfers in PA have to go through a PA FFL. Long gun tranfers are still good ftf without one, though.

[ceyko]

Yeah, just for the record I talked with an FFL guy that I know and trust. He's doing it and taking a copy of both of our CHLs for proof that we're both legal to own weapons...etc...etc.

Either way, if I buy it - it'll be FFL oriented from what I can tell at this point in my education on this matter. So even if I bought it online and had it shipped...etc...etc. At least this way maybe we can go get it broken in at one of the local ranges (or my back yard) so it's ready for use when he gets it.

The only other way that would make sense is to give him the money and have him go buy it - that's just cheesy - especially since the wife is all about gift opening. Of course, I could let him open mine in a box and then tell him to go buy it at home - as I snatch it back. lol

[svauto-erotic855]

That would be an interstate straw purchase, a double no-no.

Malum prohibitum vs Malum in se

All gun laws are bullshit.