Whole house surge protection?

[miketyler]

I see them installing these in and beside panels on the home improvement shows. Does anyone know how these work? DIY install? Do these reset after a surge or are they one-time blow and then replace? I see some Square-D units on eBay. They mention they are best installed as close to the main breaker as possible but my panel is nearly full and I dont know if I have anough slack to relocate the top most breakers.

[jw33]

They are for a close lightning strike that gets into the electrical line. Probably has an MOV that clears one time if it does it's job. Not a bad idea if it's failry cheap, but I would still run a decent UPS on the higher dollar home electronics.

[YALE]

Remember to ask your home insurer about breaker-installed surge protectors. Some of them will give you a premium discount if you have one installed.

[RuStYpNuS]

How much are they wanting for them. Sycom is what we installed they were backed with life time warranties a $25000 coverage for anything that gets damaged and install by tapping into the main breaker or meters

[YALE]

The last time I priced one, it was around $700. I was going to see if I could get it taken off my rent, but the landlord didn't go for it.

[RuStYpNuS]

Damn it I can still get the surge protectors and install them myself for little to nothing.

[RuStYpNuS]

And since I neglected to mention we were doing it for 250 installed

[YALE]

Nice! I think it was so high because we priced it through a liscensed electrician. We had to call one, because, "we," (my ex-girlfriend) melted a wall socket and almost burned the house down, and repairs were on us. I was going to prevent that from happening again.

[RuStYpNuS]

Lol well this was back when I was a contractor for home warranty companies. Just to replace a wall socket and install a surge protector should have only been around 400. I'm not gonna lie if we could get away with charging more we sure as hell wouldn't say no to it lol.

[miketyler]

Is all damage done to electronics from the lightining entering the lines? During storms we may see a blip in power. That is, a case where there is a sudden millisecond drop in power, then before you can blink comes right back on. I thought it was this sudden followup voltage that kills some power sensitive devices?

I have a Monster and a Paramax power conditioners in my rack. The second the power drops, they shut off and do not allow the power to come back thru till I manually reset them. Do these whole-house units protect against that type of abnormality?

[westom]

How much are they wanting for them. Sycom is what we installed

First appreciate how easily scams get promoted. It is called a surge protector. So it must be surge protection? Nonsense. Those are two completely different devices.

Typically destructive surges seek earth ground. Either connects that energy harmlessly to earth. Or that energy goes hunting for earth, destructively, via household appliances. Once that energy is inside, then nothing can avert the hunt. Nothing.

Protection is where hundreds of thousands of joules are harmlessly absorbed. That is single point earth ground. A ground that must both meet and exceed post 1990 code requirements.

What does a protector do? Connect surge energy short (ie 'less than 10 foot') to earth. No protector does protection. It only connects (bonds, diverts, shunts) energy to protection. Most educated by advertising assumes hundreds of joules inside a protector will absorb hundreds of thousands of joules. A protector can only be effective when it connects short as possible to earth. The difference between a protector and protection.

Syscom is one name. Other more responsible companies include ABB, Leviton, Square D, General Electric, Siemens, and Intermatic. A Cutler-Hammer solution sells in Lowes and Home Depot for less than $50.

A direct lightning strike is typically 20,000 amps. A minimally sized 'whole house' protector must be 50,000 amps. The electrical connection must be short, no sharp wire bends, not inside metallic conduit, no splices, and separated from other non-grounding wires. All factors critical for low impedance.

Other incoming wires also must be protected. Cable and satellite dish needs no protector. That incoming coax cable connects, as defined above, only with a wire. Better protection means no protector required to make that connection.

What happened to that hundreds of joules protector inside a wall receptacle box? Either the protector disconnects from a surge as fast as possible (that failure promotes myths). Or creates a potential house fire (when it does not disconnect fast enough). Either way, superior protection inside the appliance protects that appliance. The protectors without an always required short connection to earth does virtually nothing.

Protection is always about where energy dissipates. Single point earth ground is the protection. Protector (if connected that short and other critical requirements) connects massive energy to earth. How to make that protector better? Upgrade the earthing. A protector is only as effective as its earth ground.

[BERNIE MOSFET]

First appreciate how easily scams get promoted. It is called a surge protector. So it must be surge protection? Nonsense. Those are two completely different devices.

Typically destructive surges seek earth ground. Either connects that energy harmlessly to earth. Or that energy goes hunting for earth, destructively, via household appliances. Once that energy is inside, then nothing can avert the hunt. Nothing.

Protection is where hundreds of thousands of joules are harmlessly absorbed. That is single point earth ground. A ground that must both meet and exceed post 1990 code requirements.

What does a protector do? Connect surge energy short (ie 'less than 10 foot') to earth. No protector does protection. It only connects (bonds, diverts, shunts) energy to protection. Most educated by advertising assumes hundreds of joules inside a protector will absorb hundreds of thousands of joules. A protector can only be effective when it connects short as possible to earth. The difference between a protector and protection.

Syscom is one name. Other more responsible companies include ABB, Leviton, Square D, General Electric, Siemens, and Intermatic. A Cutler-Hammer solution sells in Lowes and Home Depot for less than $50.

A direct lightning strike is typically 20,000 amps. A minimally sized 'whole house' protector must be 50,000 amps. The electrical connection must be short, no sharp wire bends, not inside metallic conduit, no splices, and separated from other non-grounding wires. All factors critical for low impedance.

Other incoming wires also must be protected. Cable and satellite dish needs no protector. That incoming coax cable connects, as defined above, only with a wire. Better protection means no protector required to make that connection.

What happened to that hundreds of joules protector inside a wall receptacle box? Either the protector disconnects from a surge as fast as possible (that failure promotes myths). Or creates a potential house fire (when it does not disconnect fast enough). Either way, superior protection inside the appliance protects that appliance. The protectors without an always required short connection to earth does virtually nothing.

Protection is always about where energy dissipates. Single point earth ground is the protection. Protector (if connected that short and other critical requirements) connects massive energy to earth. How to make that protector better? Upgrade the earthing. A protector is only as effective as its earth ground.

In cases of direct strikes, yes. Without an isolated, grounded lightning arrester, there is no way to control or protect against a direct strike.

However, transients (power surge) at lower voltages and currents than experienced with a direct strike can develop because of nearby direct or indirect strikes that can cause problems within loads on the power grid (i.e. your house and everything in it). Normal breakers don't adequately protect against transients because they occur so fast that the breaker simply can't switch itself off before the transient passes. Transients require a fast-acting device to disrupt them - and surge protectors do this.

[westom]

Normal breakers don't adequately protect against transients because they occur so fast that the breaker simply can't switch itself off before the transient passes. Transients require a fast-acting device to disrupt them - and surge protectors do this.

Any device that protects by disconnecting or disrupting is a scam. How does something done in microseconds get stopped by something that takes milliseconds to disrupt? It doesn't. How does something no stopped by three miles of sky get stopped by centimeter magic devices inside a building? It doesn't.

Why discuss breakers? Breakers are not for surge protection. Breakers are to avoid fire and human safety problems after damage has occurred. Anything that would stop, block, or disrupt a surge is a scam.

'Whole house' protectors are rated for 50,000 amps or higher to make even direct lightning strikes irrelevant. As was done even 100 years ago.

Your telco connects their computer to buildings all over town. Suffers about 100 surges with each thunderstorm. How often is your town without phone service for four days while they replace their computer? Never? Because protection from driect lightning strikes is that routine. Because telcos do not waste money on plug-in protectors. Because every incoming wire first connects as short as possible to earth via a 'whole house' protector. And because the protectors are located up to 50 meters distant from electronics. Separation between protector and electronics increases protection so that even direct lighting strikes cause no damage.

[BERNIE MOSFET]

Any device that protects by disconnecting or disrupting is a scam. How does something done in microseconds get stopped by something that takes milliseconds to disrupt? It doesn't. How does something no stopped by three miles of sky get stopped by centimeter magic devices inside a building? It doesn't.

Surge protectors, as I pointed out, don't stop direct strikes. Surge protectors stop transients which are not direct strikes. A transient is an over voltage. Not direct current from lightning. We aren't talking about direct lightning strikes. We are talking about power surges due to transients that can come from but are not limited to the effects of atmospheric electrical activity, indirect strikes, and direct strikes to equipment near but not at the home. That's what surge protectors protect against!

Do you know what an MOV is? Their response time can be measured in nanoseconds. How does something that takes microseconds to develop get stopped? By something that takes nanoseconds to respond to. Does an MOV stop a direct strike? No, of course not, but the OP doesn't appear to be concerned with a direct strike.

Why discuss breakers? Breakers are not for surge protection. Breakers are to avoid fire and human safety problems after damage has occurred. Anything that would stop, block, or disrupt a surge is a scam.

You non-reading fuck. I said breakers aren't for surge protection. I brought them up to make a point about response time - and surge protectors in purpose; as opposed, again, to lightning arresting equipment that is designed for direct strikes. Your concept of a surge as a direct strike at 50,000 amps or higher is nice, and you have very adequately made your point that surge protectors don't stop the effects of a direct strike, but there are other effects at lower power levels that surge protectors are useful for.

Your telco connects their computer to buildings all over town. Suffers about 100 surges with each thunderstorm. How often is your town without phone service for four days while they replace their computer? Never? Because protection from driect lightning strikes is that routine. Because telcos do not waste money on plug-in protectors. Because every incoming wire first connects as short as possible to earth via a 'whole house' protector. And because the protectors are located up to 50 meters distant from electronics. Separation between protector and electronics increases protection so that even direct lighting strikes cause no damage.

Routine and inexpensive & practicable for a homeowner to install may not be the same. You are talking about commercial applications. That's nice, but homeowners do not have 50 meters separation between their electronics and incoming power lines, to start. Then there is the matter of working with what has already been installed in the home. It takes money to rework their electrical equipment, and when it comes to this type of work, most people are unwilling to do it themselves. Enter licensed and bonded electricians who will charge a fortune. At some point the value of what you are trying to protect does not warrant the cost of protecting it.

[RuStYpNuS]

Yes drew he is a non reading Fuck. Lmao and besides I never said they actually worked in protecting against lightning but on more than one occasion I personally responded to claims where lightning struck the home completely took out the surge protector and we replaced it free of charge. And again with a 25000 dollar property damage coverage the customer was happy to have decided to do it. I don't give a fuck if I pay 250 dollars for a bad of dog shit installed in my panel if it covers my appliances in the event of lightning stike then fill it to the top for all I care

And hey newb go contribute in the nsfw threads before you get banned