our HS newspaper? WTF????

[Venom]

Now she is claiming that her quote was paraphrased. I can see this happening with some stupid newspaper twirp. BTW the editor is a student also. They have a teacher that "supervises" them but they don't really have much say in what goes on.

I agree with everyone that the public education system needs a serious overhaul. The good teachers that want to teach students stuff that they are actually going to need/use can't because it's drilled into our head that they must pass the TAKS so we have to basically teach them how to pass the test.

[bcoop]

Now she is claiming that her quote was paraphrased. I can see this happening with some stupid newspaper twirp. BTW the editor is a student also. They have a teacher that "supervises" them but they don't really have much say in what goes on.

I agree with everyone that the public education system needs a serious overhaul. The good teachers that want to teach students stuff that they are actually going to need/use can't because it's drilled into our head that they must pass the TAKS so we have to basically teach them how to pass the test.

Yep. You can't have a successful education system when teaching to standardized tests or the lowest common denominator. I'm sure there are some bad teachers, just as with any profession, but most that I know hate their jobs because of the standardized testing.

[bcoop]

I think there need to be more vocational/trade type programs. Not everybody is college material.

a lot of kids just give up because they don't do well in traditional courses... but those kids might shine at mechanical, welding, etc. they could get a job right out of highschool making $30-40k+

but without those vocational classes, most will waste a year or two at community college and end up in some shitty retail job

I agree that not everyone is college material. I'm not college material. I just think the dollars are better spent on real education, and let the ditch diggers go to trade school after high school.

[BERNIE MOSFET]

their are many teachers that don't know a g/d thing about anything.
Even what they teach.

many people who seemed to have failed in life so badly in the workplace, go on to be professors. I think this somehow gives them renewed faith by having people be forced to listen to their BS dribble.
Go to any college, you won't have any problem finding a few so completely and obviously diluded in their own rationalizations of how things work in the real world.
Schools are like a mecca for these people. They are completely protected from having to prove any real fruition of their work. Like with success actually earned or delivering real world results where obstacles exist. Plus there is a steady stream of fresh minds to plunder away with their unrelated(to the class) nonsense.

Clearly they failed in teaching you the difference between there and their. I know, homonyms are so hard! Capitalization? Dribble or drivel? Are you lazy, or do you not know?

It's OK if you are being lazy, but keep in mind that if you are going to be critical of educators, try to write properly. Your writing indicates much about your character, and offers as much about your level of education - formal or not - of which you, and only you, are responsible for. Teachers embody the venerable adage "you can lead a horse to water..."

That said, I'm curious about what college courses you've taken, and at which campuses. Where in the world have you gotten the idea that collegiate level educators don't know shit? I know of a few that run successful businesses on the side, write for a living, or are otherwise employed elsewhere in the industry/field that they teach in. Most conduct research. Do you have any idea how competitive research funding is, or how they go about securing that funding? How to get additional funding once their projects are completed and they report their findings?

[BERNIE MOSFET]

Now she is claiming that her quote was paraphrased. I can see this happening with some stupid newspaper twirp. BTW the editor is a student also. They have a teacher that "supervises" them but they don't really have much say in what goes on.

I'd believe that.

[GSRGuy94]

behind ever blade of grass..............

Dey took er jerbs!!!

[futant]

Clearly they failed in teaching you the difference between there and their. I know, homonyms are so hard! Capitalization? Dribble or drivel? Are you lazy, or do you not know?

It's OK if you are being lazy, but keep in mind that if you are going to be critical of educators, try to write properly. Your writing indicates much about your character, and offers as much about your level of education - formal or not - of which you, and only you, are responsible for. Teachers embody the venerable adage "you can lead a horse to water..."

That said, I'm curious about what college courses you've taken, and at which campuses. Where in the world have you gotten the idea that collegiate level educators don't know shit? I know of a few that run successful businesses on the side, write for a living, or are otherwise employed elsewhere in the industry/field that they teach in. Most conduct research. Do you have any idea how competitive research funding is, or how they go about securing that funding? How to get additional funding once their projects are completed and they report their findings?

ok I'm lazy and I typed that quickly .... you got me
to be honest it sounds like you have some sort of emotional goal here to maintain professors' images . That's all dandy and I'm happy for you if you've seen the good ones.
If you had read what I put , I clearly said many had failed at their previous job. You apparently consider that a plus and that doing research obviously entitles them to some sort of elitist level. Just as they typically portray.
If I was to characterize your post, it's quite similar to their attitude. That *most* are so above the course material they intend to teach that they've forgotten the teaching part of it.
seriously .... capitalization lol thanks buddy, really getting the message there teach . I'm glad you pointed that out, cause that's so damn relevant to the other points i made.
If you're really interested in my education. It's nadda, HS. I am a self taught IT / IS professional who makes more than many people with substantial degrees. I based my comments about professors by all the countless people's statements they have made about the classes they take and the shit hole job the professors do. Look you don't have to believe me, I don't have some kind of vested interest here. It wasn't my dough that got lost, it was theirs.
When they do a shit job, their students take notice.
College's are a flop house for the less inclined professionals, not some kind of heavenly body of enthusiast's entitled to their ever so valid OPINIONS which end up filling the time slots they have. Instead they should do WTF theyre paid to , teach the damn material. So the student will have a good chance on the next class they have on the subject matter, which may be more advanced.

Let me give you a case in point - IT/IS , WTF kind of dismal failure are colleges at that?
glad i didn't try that out and wasted my money like so many.

btw,
No that isn't what the people I have talked to have taken for coursework.

[BERNIE MOSFET]

ok I'm lazy and I typed that quickly .... you got me
to be honest it sounds like you have some sort of emotional goal here to maintain professors' images . That's all dandy and I'm happy for you if you've seen the good ones.
If you had read what I put , I clearly said many had failed at their previous job. You apparently consider that a plus and that doing research obviously entitles them to some sort of elitist level. Just as they typically portray.
If I was to characterize your post, it's quite similar to their attitude. That *most* are so above the course material they intend to teach that they've forgotten the teaching part of it.
seriously .... capitalization lol thanks buddy, really getting the message there teach . I'm glad you pointed that out, cause that's so damn relevant to the other points i made.
If you're really interested in my education. It's nadda, HS. I am a self taught IT / IS professional who makes more than many people with substantial degrees. I based my comments about professors by all the countless people's statements they have made about the classes they take and the shit hole job the professors do. Look you don't have to believe me, I don't have some kind of vested interest here. It wasn't my dough that got lost, it was theirs.
When they do a shit job, their students take notice.
College's are a flop house for the less inclined professionals, not some kind of heavenly body of enthusiast's entitled to their ever so valid OPINIONS which end up filling the time slots they have. Instead they should do WTF theyre paid to , teach the damn material. So the student will have a good chance on the next class they have on the subject matter, which may be more advanced.

Let me give you a case in point - IT/IS , WTF kind of dismal failure are colleges at that?
glad i didn't try that out and wasted my money like so many.

btw,
No that isn't what the people I have talked to have taken for coursework.

It took me a while to sort through your discombobulated post. I laughed at the presumption that I have an "emotional goal to maintain professors' images." I was also amused by the conclusion you drew about my lack of reading comprehension, particularly when my post was a direct rebuttal to the things you were saying in your post.

I took notice of your first post because I strongly suspected that you had no first hand knowledge of what college is about. You are basing your arguments solely on what you have heard from other people. You aren't entirely wrong, but you have to understand that you are over-generalizing college academia.

I know the type of professors you are talking about. They do exist - same as in any profession. But that's not the norm - especially when you get away from basic material at community colleges and into more rigourous coursework at universities. The problem you've identified, whether you know it or not, is not that there is an abundance of hacks teaching at the collegiate level, but that there is an abundance of people who think that education is something you buy. Worse yet is the idea that buying an education buys your way into the job market. While this is true in many regards, it places the emphasis on the end, and not the means.

As far as criticizing your capitalization (nitpicking all of the errors you made, really), it was precisely relevant to the points you made. I keyed on things that weren't relevent, same as the arguments against the bad profs. The point is not that you made the errors, but that I was able to get the message in spite of the errors. The corollary is that there are going to be professors who aren't very good at presenting material (or who downright fail at it), but it is still incumbant on the student to get their education regardless. Does that make sense?

And good on you for teaching yourself what you needed to know to be a contributing member of society. I mean that. I know what IT guys can make, particularly when they work for themselves.

[futant]

Well I applaude this not turning into a firefight as I expected it would quickly hasten there

A lot of the complaint I hear is professors outright failing to teach well. some hardly try even. Older ones that only lecture, therefore students don't want to show up. I certainly agree that you can only lead the horse to water, but it amazes me (as a 3rd party) the degree in which i hear the complaints and likeness of them to each other(independent of campus or degree).
Most comments are not in spite of doing poorly in the class either. More that they do not feel they are gaining what they need due to approach taken , or possibly lack there of. Generally what I already touched on, they just don't feel like they are getting their money worth. Some even desperation, as their new class is hard, being forced to cover an unrealistic amount of material (like say ten chapters before next class on day one!) , while their last class coasted through it doing a lackluster job.
i.e. - students having to study coursework wildly in search of what they will be tested on , then entire classes failing the exam and no curve given.
or teachers forgetting they told them to study X section, then testing on Y. Further then providing no recourse to 'catch up' for them.

literally my opinion is the only thing that makes sense, incompetent , incumbant morons are out there teaching. Many of whom I have heard (alas through someone else) were high end pro's in their field. By their own words , were making MORE money than they are now. To me , I take that as the comical nonsense that it is... they are just talking it up to downplay the reality of their current situation. Which isn't to say I think lowly of professors in general. My deal is with the job being done, only.

As you mentioned, yes I've heard many reports of good teachers too. To be totally fair, great ones.... that embolden the students and make them want to learn. That cover material thoroughly, enabling the students to prepare well. Pretty impossible to say whether the good/bad professors are in the minority/ majority.
to me, if it's 50/50 thats a good indication that schools do not work by the same set of rules that other professional organizations must.
That you must do your job, or you'll be fired. That results must be met. That those goals missed or made must be substantiated.
That isn't what i see. I see 50 out of 100, which is FAIL. Equals the business would tank or you would be replaced.

[Venom]

Well I applaude this not turning into a firefight as I expected it would quickly hasten there

A lot of the complaint I hear is professors outright failing to teach well. some hardly try even. Older ones that only lecture, therefore students don't want to show up. I certainly agree that you can only lead the horse to water, but it amazes me (as a 3rd party) the degree in which i hear the complaints and likeness of them to each other(independent of campus or degree).
Most comments are not in spite of doing poorly in the class either. More that they do not feel they are gaining what they need due to approach taken , or possibly lack there of. Generally what I already touched on, they just don't feel like they are getting their money worth. Some even desperation, as their new class is hard, being forced to cover an unrealistic amount of material (like say ten chapters before next class on day one!) , while their last class coasted through it doing a lackluster job.
i.e. - students having to study coursework wildly in search of what they will be tested on , then entire classes failing the exam and no curve given.
or teachers forgetting they told them to study X section, then testing on Y. Further then providing no recourse to 'catch up' for them.

literally my opinion is the only thing that makes sense, incompetent , incumbant morons are out there teaching. Many of whom I have heard (alas through someone else) were high end pro's in their field. By their own words , were making MORE money than they are now. To me , I take that as the comical nonsense that it is... they are just talking it up to downplay the reality of their current situation. Which isn't to say I think lowly of professors in general. My deal is with the job being done, only.

As you mentioned, yes I've heard many reports of good teachers too. To be totally fair, great ones.... that embolden the students and make them want to learn. That cover material thoroughly, enabling the students to prepare well. Pretty impossible to say whether the good/bad professors are in the minority/ majority.
to me, if it's 50/50 thats a good indication that schools do not work by the same set of rules that other professional organizations must.
That you must do your job, or you'll be fired. That results must be met. That those goals missed or made must be substantiated.
That isn't what i see. I see 50 out of 100, which is FAIL. Equals the business would tank or you would be replaced.

College is about higher learning. The professor has to take into account how the majority of the students learn and if he feels that it's using lecture that's what he will do. You really don't get into hands on learning until you get into your upper level classes. College is just like anything else you get out of it what you put in.
Being in the Navy I went to many colleges/universities while finishing my degree. I had some great professors and I also had some really shitty ones. If I felt I wasn't getting the information that I needed I sought out other sources to get it. It seems like the people that you are getting your information from want an education spoon fed to them.

[Forever_frost]

College isn't about higher learning. It's about regurgitation. I have brain damage and give almost zero effort and I'm running a 3.8 GPA in graduate school. Tenured professors are the worst as they have nothing to lose and I have been told "I don't care what you put on your evaluations, I have tenure." They don't teach, they expound on their beliefs, usually a liberal lean.

The only thing worse than the grad school was being an undergrad which meant I had to take classes I cared nothing about (math, English, etc) to pursue my degree. It's a waste of time. If you do not know how to write a paper by the time you're in college, you shouldn't be there. As far as teaching math, unless it's directly related to my degree, I shouldn't have to take it. I'm paying for this and I know what interests me. I'm not here to be a good global citizen (as I was told last week), I'm here to get a piece of paper so I can do a task that I've already researched enough to do it anyway, but employers want that masters degree.

That being said, I have an easier time of it than most. I buck authority and professors respect that. I've gone nose to nose with several repeatedly because they were wrong, I could prove them wrong and did so because it was just painful to hear them be so wrong. And yes, when I corrected them, I did it in a condescending manner. As a student, I should never be better informed than the tenured professor who is 'teaching' me.

[futant]

College isn't about higher learning. It's about regurgitation. I have brain damage and give almost zero effort and I'm running a 3.8 GPA in graduate school. Tenured professors are the worst as they have nothing to lose and I have been told "I don't care what you put on your evaluations, I have tenure." They don't teach, they expound on their beliefs, usually a liberal lean.

The only thing worse than the grad school was being an undergrad which meant I had to take classes I cared nothing about (math, English, etc) to pursue my degree. It's a waste of time. If you do not know how to write a paper by the time you're in college, you shouldn't be there. As far as teaching math, unless it's directly related to my degree, I shouldn't have to take it. I'm paying for this and I know what interests me. I'm not here to be a good global citizen (as I was told last week), I'm here to get a piece of paper so I can do a task that I've already researched enough to do it anyway, but employers want that masters degree.

That being said, I have an easier time of it than most. I buck authority and professors respect that. I've gone nose to nose with several repeatedly because they were wrong, I could prove them wrong and did so because it was just painful to hear them be so wrong. And yes, when I corrected them, I did it in a condescending manner. As a student, I should never be better informed than the tenured professor who is 'teaching' me.

Wow, seriously BRAVO.
I have heard some really assinine things repeated to me that college professors have said. Some of it just plain hard to even believe that an 'educated person' would even claim.
Maybe that is where my disdain for college professors comes from the most.

It amazes people are sitting there listening to some of this crap and paying for it. Yes I also agree much of it has had very liberal basis . Why that in particular is in common.... I don't know.

Likewise I feel an attitude much like your post portrayed. That if they would say such a thing, how can you have any respect for the position they hold and the nonsense being regurgitated.
Furthermore, how could no one stand up and call it for the bullshit it really is?

I seriously think the professors feel this is where they can preach, and that students fear repurcussions for challenging them in class and possibly making them look foolish for the outlandish claims presented.
Kind of like if you boss says fucking retarded things unrelated to your job. you just stfu and move on.

Schools and colleges have become a haven for these people, whether it wants to be admitted or not. It's true, and they are protected.
That is what should come to an end. They should do their job, teach, lecture , whatever.
It's not like I would sit here and make absurd personal claims about life and such with my tech customers on the phone. I'm a professional.

That is what this thread is about.

[forbes]

IMO, the failure of the school system started when we removed woodshop, auto, metal shop etc. We as a society have made the kids of today lazy. They all want to go to college, get out and make 100k a year jobs in some plush office. They want a first home like their parents have and nice cars.Life don't work that way, you have to struggle and make sacrifices to get to where you want. we have taught kids to run from physical work (construction, metal fab, etc) which opens up the market for anybody (illegals) to do these jobs. I opted to pursue construction as a kid ( everyone in my family was a carpenter) and i have been very successful in my business. but it has been full of hard times and starting off small and learning to build it up ( and loose it) the whole time. Don't get me wrong, college is great for those who choose that route, but many of my "college educated" friends are serving burgers or some other lame job because that is all they can get ?rant off?

[SMEGMA STENCH]

They're all constantly told that they'll be rich and have it all just like their pitiful MTV heros.