Japan's top court has approved blanket surveillance of the country's Muslims

[Broncojohnny]

The constitution should be absolutely obeyed unless there is some sort of grave threat to Americans and there is no other course of action. I am not sure how it could be any worse than having a subset of one group who is committing suicide to kill citizens.

Stop buying into the hype that surveillance of these people is somehow equivalent to persecution. It isn't even close.

[LANTIRN]

I get where you're coming from Lantirn, and, and I agree with it. I really do. What worries me is that there will be a day, perhaps soon, this will be akin to arguing the rights of a Roman as the Visigoths breach the city gates.

This argument and every other argument is all academic anyway. Nothing will be done about it. I'm not sure anything can be done about it.

When our entire govt apparatus has been co-opted and corrupted for the purpose, but by no means the sole purpose, of allowing people that are and have proven to be a legitimate threat to the American way of life, what can be done? What legal recourse do the people have?

1) Laws have no effect. They are either ignored or actively not enforced.

See Hillary's breaking of the espionage act and the records act.

See the reason of just about any speech Obama gives.

See his pen and his phone.

2) The Supreme Court is of no help. You have half the court aiding and abetting Obama in whatever autocratic flight of fancy he desires. In the few cases where the other half of the Court sided with Liberty you have Obama and his monarchical sycophants straight up tell the people and the court they aren't going to abide.

The most recent example of this is the slap down of his mass amnesty of illegals.
Other examples include his and his party's constant flouting of the Heller decision by imposing bans on the carriage of guns in cities like Chiraq, D.C., and many cities in Cali.

3) Even if laws did have an effect, the third- supposedly co-equal branch of govt has practically abdicated its authority to the Executive.

See the Iranian Nuke deal, which was a treaty which per the constitution required ratification from the Senate.

See every fucking budget deal for the last 8 years.

See the Obamacare bill.

See dozens, hundreds of other examples from a simple google search.

Congress' husbanding of its power and prerogatives are about as effective as the first two minutes of any fuck-my-wife porno you've ever seen.

4) The 4th branch of government - the bureaucratic class of .gov, writing tens of thousands of regulations every year that have the effect of law to the equestrian and Plebians. Regulations too numerous and arcane for even the most learned and studious lawyers to not run afoul of. Regulations that more and more serve as the spider's web to snare the unsuspecting citizen and destroy his or her livelihood and/or life.

See the example of the family who couldn't save their house from a cliff eroding because of some fucking arcane bug.

See the example of the EPA fining the livelihood out of many a family for bullshit reasons like disturbing wetlands - wetlands being in these cases ponds and fucking puddles.

See the protection of the baitfish - the Delta fucking smelt where thousands of Californian farms were reclaimed by the desert for want of irrigating their crops.

5) The fifth column that is our media. These people were supposed to check the government's power. To act as our last line of defense against a Tyranny and to sound the warning to the citizenry in the event of such.

They are explicitly protected in our first amendment for Christ's sake.

See about any single hour of new coverage, picked at random, at any point in the last 25 years.



We'll still be here dickering about the human rights of sub-humans, their protectors and facilitators as the knife enters our back.

The only thing I disagree with you on is the last comment about calling them subhuman, assuming you mean all muslims instead of just the extremists (since the original article references all of them in Japan). I have known good and decent muslims, in Saudi Arabia. We cannot classify all of one people based off of the actions of some. To do so we are no better than the Nazis regarding Jews, or our government regarding Japanese. I believe in conducting wars to win them, but we must be cautious and take the high road on certain points. I cannot stress enough that so many times in history the classification of entire peoples has lead to mass genocide. Individuals are smart. People are dumb, and scared people are downright dangerous. We must cautious.

[sc281]

The only thing I disagree with you on is the last comment about calling them subhuman, assuming you mean all muslims instead of just the extremists (since the original article references all of them in Japan). I have known good and decent muslims, in Saudi Arabia. We cannot classify all of one people based off of the actions of some. To do so we are no better than the Nazis regarding Jews, or our government regarding Japanese. I believe in conducting wars to win them, but we must be cautious and take the high road on certain points. I cannot stress enough that so many times in history the classification of entire peoples has lead to mass genocide. Individuals are smart. People are dumb, and scared people are downright dangerous. We must cautious.

That is my mistake for not clarifying. That comment is directed at the Islamic jihadis and also the so called moderate Imams, media mouthpieces and front groups like CAIR, and the moderates that put on the face of innocence and the garb of sheep, such as the grocer in Germany who was presumed innocent until found to have 200+ ak's hidden in the store room.

I know many Muslims that are decent well meaning people
as well. I've even dated one or two of them over the years.

That doesn't mean they are in the right on their faith though. If their mosque preaches terrorist shit and they, for whatever reason, do not repudiate and try to oppose it, they are appearig as guilty as the the one that does the killing. And since they don't wear uniforms to identify their army as required by the Geneva convention for civilized warfare it is a problem. That doesn't, however, mean it's our problem.

This problem, luckily, has a simple solution. A simple choice. Not necessarily easy, as some of these people might be family or close friends, but simple enough.

They have a choice to either leave the faith or congregate with those who actually practice the lauded peace their religion is comprised of. By not doing so they are also making a choice. They are choosing to have these subhumans in their midst, preaching to their children, attending their services, and corrupting their faith

It's precisely because they choose this that taking the threat out properly can result in collateral damage. That's the problem when you mix the evil in with the supposed good.

Is it wrong to bomb the school or the mosque or the hospital when these places are where the terrorists themselves do their terrorist shit?

We didn't firebomb places like Dresden to kill thousands of women and children. We firebombed Dresden to kill Nazis.

A doctor doesn't excise a tumor and leave the necrotic, cancerous flesh. He takes out the whole thing. Doing so may also result in otherwise healthy tissue being damaged or removed. Despite this, surgery still gets done.

It is my fervent hope that in the coming years the peaceful majority guide their religion off of this path. The longer they let these subhumans walk among them, the more the remaining 5.5 billion people on the planet are encouraged to roll up their sleeves and start scrubbing in.

[LANTIRN]

That is my mistake for not clarifying. That comment is directed at the Islamic jihadis and also the so called moderate Imams, media mouthpieces and front groups like CAIR, and the moderates that put on the face of innocence and the garb of sheep, such as the grocer in Germany who was presumed innocent until found to have 200+ ak's hidden in the store room.

I know many Muslims that are decent well meaning people
as well. I've even dated one or two of them over the years.

That doesn't mean they are in the right on their faith though. If their mosque preaches terrorist shit and they, for whatever reason, do not repudiate and try to oppose it, they are appearig as guilty as the the one that does the killing. And since they don't wear uniforms to identify their army as required by the Geneva convention for civilized warfare it is a problem. That doesn't, however, mean it's our problem.

This problem, luckily, has a simple solution. A simple choice. Not necessarily easy, as some of these people might be family or close friends, but simple enough.

They have a choice to either leave the faith or congregate with those who actually practice the lauded peace their religion is comprised of. By not doing so they are also making a choice. They are choosing to have these subhumans in their midst, preaching to their children, attending their services, and corrupting their faith

It's precisely because they choose this that taking the threat out properly can result in collateral damage. That's the problem when you mix the evil in with the supposed good.

Is it wrong to bomb the school or the mosque or the hospital when these places are where the terrorists themselves do their terrorist shit?

We didn't firebomb places like Dresden to kill thousands of women and children. We firebombed Dresden to kill Nazis.

A doctor doesn't excise a tumor and leave the necrotic, cancerous flesh. He takes out the whole thing. Doing so may also result in otherwise healthy tissue being damaged or removed. Despite this, surgery still gets done.

It is my fervent hope that in the coming years the peaceful majority guide their religion off of this path. The longer they let these subhumans walk among them, the more the remaining 5.5 billion people on the planet are encouraged to roll up their sleeves and start scrubbing in.

Unfortunately I do not see them reforming their religion anytime soon. This jihad / caliphate movement has been going on for hundreds of years, has been growing, and only recently have we seen a few stand up against it in public. It won't reform itself for another hundred years or more and I believe you are correct in that we will be forced to clean their house or suffer the consequences. Unfortunately their ideology cannot be forced into surrender like other militaries we have fought. When your enemies goal is jihad, to die while fighting, they have no reason to surrender. The only way to win this will be to kill every extremist and false moderate on the planet while the real moderates reform it. I hate that is the answer but it is the only one I see, and it has a high chance of turning real moderates into extremists creating a vicious cycle.

[46Tbird]

No one deserves to be treated like a criminal just because of their religion.

The only way to win this will be to kill every extremist and false moderate on the planet while the real moderates reform it. I hate that is the answer but it is the only one I see,

Interesting.

[LANTIRN]

Interesting.

The extremists and false moderate are the ones waging jihad. The truely peaceful muslims should not be treated as criminals because of the others. Not a difficult concept.

[46Tbird]

That sounds neat. I'd love to know where you got your patented Truly Peaceful Muslim Detector™ kit. I'll stop and pick one up on my way home tonight.

[line-em-up]

The extremists and false moderate are the ones waging jihad. The truely peaceful muslims should not be treated as criminals because of the others. Not a difficult concept.

One of these is going to blow themselves up in a crowded building. Can you identify which one?

[bubbaearl]

the ones blowing themselves up are not the problem. the problem is the muslim brotherhood . they are quietly stacking the odds in towns around the country. voting in members to various offices in city/county government . the white house is full of them. they know full well they can not defeat us toe to toe but look to change our government to allow their beliefs and values to become law. it is already happened in europe and here in the northeast.
while the lion slept we stole his claws .......

[jluv]

One of these is going to blow themselves up in a crowded building. Can you identify which one?

I think it's that bitch in the middle.

[line-em-up]

the ones blowing themselves up are not the problem. the problem is the muslim brotherhood . they are quietly stacking the odds in towns around the country. voting in members to various offices in city/county government . the white house is full of them. they know full well they can not defeat us toe to toe but look to change our government to allow their beliefs and values to become law. it is already happened in europe and here in the northeast.
while the lion slept we stole his claws .......

I agree, but my point is that you cannot tell the good ones form the bad ones. So, our safest bet is to not allow any of them in here.

[bubbaearl]

while it may not fit todays mindset surveillance has worked well in the past. profiling also works well. i dont like big brother in my life either but we have to stay on top of it. if baptist were pulling all this crap i would say hell yes bug their church. these work visas and shit need to come to an end. stay home and fix your own damn country. as for the Syrians they need to stay and fight their own war.

[Snatch Napkin]

Using call patterns of burner phones works faster and keeps the anonymity of the masses in tact.
We don't have to single out people or get warrants on individuals to track throw away phones in this manner.
Once we find the right patterns, a more exclusive warrant can be filed, thus taking the guess work off of the judge that signs it. It also lowers the chance of lawsuit.

[LANTIRN]

One of these is going to blow themselves up in a crowded building. Can you identify which one?

This argument is no different than if the left wanted to do this to all white republicans because you never know when that lone wolf attack will happen. It amazes me how many people want protections of the constitution, except for that group, fuck them. And this isn't just about imigrants. There are a lot of muslim US citizens who have never commited an act of terror. They should not be mass surveiled just because of ther religion.

[SS Junk]

I agree, but my point is that you cannot tell the good ones form the bad ones. So, our safest bet is to not allow any of them in here.

In other words you are willing to give up living in a free society? Just remember you can't have it 100% your way. If that were to happen then freedoms of yours would be taken away in some form or fashion.