Kim orders rockets on standby to attack

[talisman]

We haven't had a swift and overwhelming response since Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

Totally fucking agree. And frankly, I don't get it.

[Denny]

Totally fucking agree. And frankly, I don't get it.

There is no money to be made in a swift, thorough ass kicking. You have to draw the mission out over years with vague objectives and goals only to end in either a tie or a loss so that there are options to start it back up later.

It is all about fueling the military industrial complex.

[Slowhand]

The idea of me worrying about the aftermath comes solely from my lack of confidence in the current administration and their inability to handle situations properly when job security is on the line. Currently, the majority of the populace has their heads in the vagina of good time Charlene. They are not concerned with the worldly matters at hand and the fubar-ed reactions.

I don't necessarily disagree, but what do you do? The solution to that as offered in this thread is to launch a preemptive strike of our own against North Korea. Disregarding the non-sequitur which that represents, what does that solve? Sure, North Korea is no longer a threat, but the Russians, who were fed up with the North Koreans, are now fairly likely to join the Chinese in being pretty upset about that and much more likely to get involved in an armed conflict with the US.

Of course, that's what the average poster in this thread seems to want: they want to provoke large scale military action. It'd be a really successful way to do it.

[sc281]

There is no money to be made in a swift, thorough ass kicking. You have to draw the mission out over years with vague objectives and goals only to end in either a tie or a loss so that there are options to start it back up later.

It is all about fueling the military industrial complex.

and Denny's coin purse.

[Forever_frost]

From what I hear, it's assumed that China is moving their forces into place to keep millions of NK's out of their country when things go south. They don't want the problems or the expense that comes with tens of millions of hungry immigrants swamping their borders when things go south.

Kim is painting himself into a corner quickly and I don't see him being able to back off of this without losing face. I think he's been fed the idea that NK is so strong for so long that he actually buys into what his father and grandfather sold the people. News said it'd take 1 minute for a NK missile to hit Seoul and 5 minutes for the fighters to get there. I was briefed that flight time for the mortars to blanket Camp Greaves was 20 seconds and it'd be smart for him to have his tanks and troops in those tunnels before the first launch.

When the ignitor hits, you drive your tanks through the tunnel walls, surrounding the US and SK forces with your much larger ones. It could very well happen that, at least for a fairly short period (days? weeks?) that NK could own Korea.

[Slowhand]

From what I hear, it's assumed that China is moving their forces into place to keep millions of NK's out of their country when things go south. They don't want the problems or the expense that comes with tens of millions of hungry immigrants swamping their borders when things go south.

Kim is painting himself into a corner quickly and I don't see him being able to back off of this without losing face. I think he's been fed the idea that NK is so strong for so long that he actually buys into what his father and grandfather sold the people. News said it'd take 1 minute for a NK missile to hit Seoul and 5 minutes for the fighters to get there. I was briefed that flight time for the mortars to blanket Camp Greaves was 20 seconds and it'd be smart for him to have his tanks and troops in those tunnels before the first launch.

When the ignitor hits, you drive your tanks through the tunnel walls, surrounding the US and SK forces with your much larger ones. It could very well happen that, at least for a fairly short period (days? weeks?) that NK could own Korea.

I saw that in something posted by the mainstream media, so it's clearly false. The Obama administration paid off the entire global press to spread disinformation about the buildup of Chinese forces!

OR is it possible that the military buildup had a different objective than described by John Q blogger?

[Pokulski-Blatz]

Of course, that's what the average poster in this thread seems to want: they want to provoke large scale military action. It'd be a really successful way to do it.

No thanks, I am OK with the US taking a bit of a vacation from war. Already had enough hearts broken in the last 10 years, no need to make it 100 times worse.

I just see a path where it could easily become a reality. This has a different feel than the usual saber rattling from NK. I am inclined to take them very seriously, I don't think it will take much for NK to do something stupid.

[Slowhand]

From what I hear, it's assumed that China is moving their forces into place to keep millions of NK's out of their country when things go south. They don't want the problems or the expense that comes with tens of millions of hungry immigrants swamping their borders when things go south.

Kim is painting himself into a corner quickly and I don't see him being able to back off of this without losing face. I think he's been fed the idea that NK is so strong for so long that he actually buys into what his father and grandfather sold the people. News said it'd take 1 minute for a NK missile to hit Seoul and 5 minutes for the fighters to get there. I was briefed that flight time for the mortars to blanket Camp Greaves was 20 seconds and it'd be smart for him to have his tanks and troops in those tunnels before the first launch.

When the ignitor hits, you drive your tanks through the tunnel walls, surrounding the US and SK forces with your much larger ones. It could very well happen that, at least for a fairly short period (days? weeks?) that NK could own Korea.

They actually had a pilot defect a couple of years ago, and the South had no idea he was in their airspace until he was putting his landing gear down.

The people who have something to fear here are the South Koreans, not us. Yes, we'll be tangentially involved (which we'll turn into massive involvement), but the South Koreans have far more at stake.

[Slowhand]

No thanks, I am OK with the US taking a bit of a vacation from war. Already had enough hearts broken in the last 10 years, no need to make it 100 times worse.

I just see a path where it could easily become a reality. This has a different feel than the usual saber rattling from NK. I am inclined to take them very seriously, I don't think it will take much for NK to do something stupid.

I don't see a preemptive strike of our own ending in anything but a near duplication of Iraq/Afghanistan. It will piss off the Chinese and the Russians and we don't even have the (small) reserve of goodwill with the global community that we had at the turn of the millennium. It will become our burden, yet again, and on we go until we face the same situation in another 15 years with Venezuela or Iran or whoever.

[Pokulski-Blatz]

They actually had a pilot defect a couple of years ago, and the South had no idea he was in their airspace until he was putting his landing gear down.

The people who have something to fear here are the South Koreans, not us. Yes, we'll be tangentially involved (which we'll turn into massive involvement), but the South Koreans have far more at stake.

I disagree. Just because we haven't had the need to institute a draft in recent years doesn't mean we wont if we have to support South Korea. The last several conflicts we have engaged in were tiny when you compare them with a fight with a China backed North Korea.

[Pokulski-Blatz]

I don't see a preemptive strike of our own ending in anything but a near duplication of Iraq/Afghanistan. It will piss off the Chinese and the Russians and we don't even have the (small) reserve of goodwill with the global community that we had at the turn of the millennium. It will become our burden, yet again, and on we go until we face the same situation in another 15 years with Venezuela or Iran or whoever.

I agree that the only play is to wait till they make their move. Any other decision would be foolish and could complicate relations with China.

[Slowhand]

I disagree. Just because we haven't had the need to institute a draft in recent years doesn't mean we wont if we have to support South Korea. The last several conflicts we have engaged in were tiny when you compare them with a fight with a China backed North Korea.

Supporting South Korea is a different deal than instigating our own fight, which is the point I'm trying to make. Let someone else be responsible for the initiation and burden of war and reconstruction, and allow ourselves to be the outside consultants that make shit happen. But we have to stop telling people that their sovereignty or human rights have been trampled on and we have to let them decide that for themselves and ask for our help, and even then, they need to be the ultimately responsible parties.

[Slowhand]

I agree that the only play is to wait till they make their move. Any other decision would be foolish and could complicate relations with China.

If North Korea fucks up, China is likely to stay out of it and the Russians are absolutely out of it; that's not likely to be the case if we instigate shit. There may be some supplies trading and some inconsequential help here and there, but they don't want any part of being involved in a full on, direct conflict with the US if they can avoid it. It doesn't make any economic for them, and making money is job 1 for the Chinese right now.

[Pokulski-Blatz]

Supporting South Korea is a different deal than instigating our own fight, which is the point I'm trying to make. Let someone else be responsible for the initiation and burden of war and reconstruction, and allow ourselves to be the outside consultants that make shit happen.

It will still cost a lot of American blood one way or another. You really think that the fist strike NK makes wont be on the US military stationed there?

That attack would be more deadly than Pearl Harbor and 9/11 combined. We would have to respond, and swiftly.

[Pokulski-Blatz]

If North Korea fucks up, China is likely to stay out of it and the Russians are absolutely out of it

I disagree. China has a standing agreement just like we do with the South to aid North Korea in a time of conflict.

Russia would want nothing to do with it. It is too busy right now rebuilding the USSR.