Texas officials about teachers: Arm them!

[BlackSnake]

Agreed. Much better to leave them all unarmed, and to let the children be slaughtered.

Never said any such a thing. Listen! I do want our teachers to have the right to carry. Just not in a school UNLESS they have advanced training. I'd like to protect our rights to carry.

How many times have you seen law inforcement catch shit from unintentionally hurting a civilian? You let this happen a few times in a school and see how quickly our CHL rights are gone

[2cammer97]

I was discussing this with my wife. I'm not sure I agree with all teachers being armed. At the very least make it legal for teachers that are CHL holders to have the choice to conceal carry (maybe even require advanced training if they do) and make it MANDATORY that the Principal and a 2nd in command have a gun and get advanced training.

I think Sleeper said it best. It's about taking away the easy target of gun free zones.

Marcus

[Machx2]

Well look at it this way: if a loony with a gun is shooting up the warehouse where I work, Im calling the police. Im not going to step into the warehouse to confront him, even though I am armed. He comes into the office where I am, then I dont have much choice, either I run and chance getting shot, or I shoot, and chance getting shot. THAT IS A CHOICE I GET TO MAKE. and I am not required to do either, I get to choose.

Yes, because a warehouse is the same as a school, where teachers with a heart will have to protect their children. You are in a warehouse full of adults. This is where you and I are different. I would be confronting the gunman, even if I wasn't an LEO. My upbringing and the military instilled into me to protect others, not hide in a corner. To each his own though.

[BlackSnake]

I was discussing this with my wife. I'm not sure I agree with all teachers being armed. At the very least make it legal for teachers that are CHL holders to have the choice to conceal carry (maybe even require advanced training if they do) and make it MANDATORY that the Principal and a 2nd in command have a gun and get advanced training.

I think Sleeper said it best. It's about taking away the easy target of gun free zones.

Marcus

Exactly my point!

[Baron Von Crowder]

Yes, because a warehouse is the same as a school, where teachers with a heart will have to protect their children. You are in a warehouse full of adults. This is where you and I are different. I would be confronting the gunman, even if I wasn't an LEO. My upbringing and the military instilled into me to protect others, not hide in a corner. To each his own though.

my wife wasnt in the military, and has zero training. Allowing CHL holders to carry will provide two benifits:

1) they will have a means to defend themselves if the need arrises.

2) Crazy people intent on shooting people will have it on thier mind that the next adult they see when they become a threat may have the means and ability to shoot and kill them.

If you require them to have special training and to be a first responder, you wont see a large number of teachers/school employees stepping up for that. If you let take the restriction away for CHL holders to carry on campus, you dont need anything else, and you arent asking for someone to put thier life on the line.

Im not trying to argue, Im saying that the requirement should not be there. Im not saying I would rather see kids get murdered, I am simply saying that, as an example, my wife will not get a CHL or carry on campus if there is any expectation for her to do anything other than defend herself with it.

[Machx2]

my wife wasnt in the military, and has zero training. Allowing CHL holders to carry will provide two benifits:

1) they will have a means to defend themselves if the need arrises.

2) Crazy people intent on shooting people will have it on thier mind that the next adult they see when they become a threat may have the means and ability to shoot and kill them.

If you require them to have special training and to be a first responder, you wont see a large number of teachers/school employees stepping up for that. If you let take the restriction away for CHL holders to carry on campus, you dont need anything else, and you arent asking for someone to put thier life on the line.

Im not trying to argue, Im saying that the requirement should not be there. Im not saying I would rather see kids get murdered, I am simply saying that, as an example, my wife will not get a CHL or carry on campus if there is any expectation for her to do anything other than defend herself with it.

I agree that it should not be required for a teacher to get a chl. But, I do think it should be opened up to where a teacher, principal, lunch lady or maintenance man can conceal carry. Just an offender knowing that there may be armed people, may shy them away. Right now, teachers can't even have pepper spray or tasers. I think they should at least be able to have less than lethal. My fiance wouldn't get a chl, however she would go for a taser.

[mikec]

Exactly.

[BlackSnake]

I agree that it should not be required for a teacher to get a chl. But, I do think it should be opened up to where a teacher, principal, lunch lady or maintenance man can conceal carry. Just an offender knowing that there may be armed people, may shy them away. Right now, teachers can't even have pepper spray or tasers. I think they should at least be able to have less than lethal. My fiance wouldn't get a chl, however she would go for a taser.

And when a shoot out happens, and it will eventually, and kids get shot by said teacher, then what? Oops? Maybe had I been trained more properly? I was just trying to make a statement to would be killers? After all, they now know that teachers have the right to carry.

Yeah, thats gonna work.

[Baron Von Crowder]

And when a shoot out happens, and it will eventually, and kids get shot by said teacher, then what? Oops? Maybe had I been trained more properly? I was just trying to make a statement to would be killers? After all, they now know that teachers have the right to carry.

Yeah, thats gonna work.

So if one kid gets shot buy "friendly fire" but the shooter doenst shoot 20 more people that they could have...

[juiceweezl]

And when a shoot out happens, and it will eventually, and kids get shot by said teacher, then what? Oops? Maybe had I been trained more properly? I was just trying to make a statement to would be killers? After all, they now know that teachers have the right to carry.

Yeah, thats gonna work.

So according to your philosophy, you get 2 choices.

1) Don't arm any faculty and administrators, and the perps can continue blasting as they have in the past. Students and faculty die plus the perp when he offs him/herself.

2) Arm the faculty and administrators and run the risk of some innocents being shot but significantly reducing the odds of and the number of innocents losing their lives.

If life is about taking odds, which one provides the better odds? Furthermore, I think everyone agrees that only those that receive proper training on how to handle situations involving a shooter should be allowed to carry. A CHL should be a requirement, but that should only allow admission into a qualifying program to be able to carry on school grounds. Beyond that, semi-annual training and requalifying should be a continuous requirement.

[mikec]

And when a shoot out happens, and it will eventually, and kids get shot by said teacher, then what? Oops? Maybe had I been trained more properly? I was just trying to make a statement to would be killers? After all, they now know that teachers have the right to carry.

Yeah, thats gonna work.

You fail to grasp that just the presence of guns stops this shit in it's tracks. I read an article over the weekend that said ALL of the mass murders in recent history have occurred in soft target gun free zones except for one, which was Gifford. One. There is absolutely no reason to grow government even more by hiring scores of people, with pay and benefits and the rest of it. We can handle this in house, with existing armament and personnel, by encouraging self dependence.

If these crazy bastards know that teachers, even one out of five I bet, were armed they would not do it to start with. Hell, just make it legal, and common practice. Post bogus numbers that "40% of teachers now carry". I would wager even that measure will stop this bullshit!

[BlackSnake]

So if one kid gets shot buy "friendly fire" but the shooter doenst shoot 20 more people that they could have...

If we lived in a perfect world.

We can "what if" all day. What if teacher never hits shooter, but shoots a student and she and 20 other students are killed?

All I'm saying is that if we want to allow guns in our schools, then require additional training.

[BlackSnake]

You fail to grasp that just the presence of guns stops this shit in it's tracks. I read an article over the weekend that said ALL of the mass murders in recent history have occurred in soft target gun free zones except for one, which was Gifford. One. There is absolutely no reason to grow government even more by hiring scores of people, with pay and benefits and the rest of it. We can handle this in house, with existing armament and personnel, by encouraging self dependence.

If these crazy bastards know that teachers, even one out of five I bet, were armed they would not do it to start with. Hell, just make it legal, and common practice. Post bogus numbers that "40% of teachers now carry". I would wager even that measure will stop this bullshit!

You are gambling now? These fucking dumbass's that are doing this shit (for the most part) are mentally ill. Do you think they give a shit? The dumb shits are shooting theirselves. They already plan on dying. I'm not ignorant enough to wager the lives of teachers and students on "they know some teachers carry now".

Why are you against mandating additional training to carry in schools. I'm mean, shit, then the bad guys surly wouldn't come to schools knowing that not only do some carry, but they also now are specially trained to handle situations of this sort. Please...

[dee]

You are gambling now? These fucking dumbass's that are doing this shit (for the most part) are mentally ill. Do you think they give a shit? The dumb shits are shooting theirselves. They already plan on dying. I'm not ignorant enough to wager the lives of teachers and students on "they know some teachers carry now".

Why are you against mandating additional training to carry in schools. I'm mean, shit, then the bad guys surly wouldn't come to schools knowing that not only do some carry, but they also now are specially trained to handle situations of this sort. Please...

Those mentally I'll individuals seem to be smart enough to go places that offer the least amount of possible armed confrontation by another individual. The goal is to remove that so called sanctuary of "gun free zones" from being an option to the ill minded people. I'm not opposed to the chl thought or the idea of extra training imo extra training is never a bad thing.

[Baron Von Crowder]

You fail to grasp that just the presence of guns stops this shit in it's tracks. I read an article over the weekend that said ALL of the mass murders in recent history have occurred in soft target gun free zones except for one, which was Gifford. One. There is absolutely no reason to grow government even more by hiring scores of people, with pay and benefits and the rest of it. We can handle this in house, with existing armament and personnel, by encouraging self dependence.

If these crazy bastards know that teachers, even one out of five I bet, were armed they would not do it to start with. Hell, just make it legal, and common practice. Post bogus numbers that "40% of teachers now carry". I would wager even that measure will stop this bullshit!

You are gambling now? These fucking dumbass's that are doing this shit (for the most part) are mentally ill. Do you think they give a shit? The dumb shits are shooting theirselves. They already plan on dying. I'm not ignorant enough to wager the lives of teachers and students on "they know some teachers carry now".

Why are you against mandating additional training to carry in schools. I'm mean, shit, then the bad guys surly wouldn't come to schools knowing that not only do some carry, but they also now are specially trained to handle situations of this sort. Please...

They arent trying to go into battle, that is why they choose to shoot up that dont allow guns. They want to go in and kill other people before killing themself. You take the security of gun free zones away, they wont be doing that as easily. They dont want to get shot, not die, and have to be held accountable.

and teachers arent going to come out in numbers to be labeled as potential killers. Ignorant people wont have their baby in a classroom where a big bad gun might shoot itself at random. The only way it will fly in any number will be secretively.