Union kills the Twinkie

[sc281]

Dude, but he's got bank receipts.

Fake ones.

[quikag]

I did union work at power plant projects that my dad managed for a construction company. I was a member of three different unions--boilermaker, bricklayer, and laborer. It was a good way to earn some money between school years. During high school, I hauled hay and mowed yards and the harder I worked the more money I made. That is not the case with unions.

I was surprised at the amount of money I made versus the work I had to do. If I tried to work hard, I would receive some "education". The union veterans would tell me to slow down or I was going to work my self out of a job. I found out later that wasn't true. They just didn't want to look bad in comparison. Truth is that the construction company and the labor union had an agreement that at least one labor union had to be present on each shift. I was guaranteed a job no matter what my effort was.

You couldn't help anybody either. On one job I was working as a laborer. We were removing panels from a heat exchanger. Only boilermakers could be in the heat exchanger. I couldn't even reach into there. They told me that if they needed someone to hand it to, then they would tell the construction company to bring another boilermaker. Once the panels hit the grating, they belonged to the laborers. I could then carry them to a 55 gallon drum but I couldn't put them in it. Only boilermakers could do that. The panels were then responsibility of the operators union. After they hit the ground, they were once again "property" of the labor union. There was always people standing around not doing anything. What a joke!

I could go on and on about the quality of the workers, what my dad had to do to make sure his company made money, etc. There was a place for unions when there were sweat shops in the US, safety issues in the workplace, and truly poor wages but with OSHA, wage laws, etc., they are not needed. Only thing they are good for now is ruining businesses.

This is sad and it's truth. We bid a construction job out in Calfornia. It was prevailing wage, so we knew what we were going to have to pay and factored that into our bid. Didn't have a problem with the rates, but they were pretty high, but whatever. We also signed some project labor agreements with two unions just for that job so they could provide manpower beyond a few guys we brought out there. What we DIDN'T price into our bid was how freaking utterly lazy most of the guys were most of the time. Our production rates were less than HALF what we can do in TX with our normal crews. If you weren't standing right behind them, they wouldn't work. Then, when they did work, it was slow motion. Completely pitiful. I don't know how those guys could go home every night and feel good about themselves.

One of our foreman we took out there, he saw a union guy his first day on our jobsite driving one of our trucks. As the truck went over bumps, his head would roll back and forth like he had no neck muscles. It was like he was stoned out of his mind. It was so ridiculous and lazy looking, we sent him away that day and requested another guy. Of course, we had to write a check right there for the full 8 hours. The next guy wasn't much better. Just pitiful.

[dewayne6243]

I haven't (and won't) belittle anyone's livelihood on this board. I happen to know that train engineers also have a ton of responsibility, especially if shit goes wrong. As a layman to both career paths, the biggest difference I can see, is when a train engine breaks, you can always get out and walk. A pilot and his passengers don't have that option.

The odds of hitting the lotto 10 times in a row is greater than being killed in a plane crash and when it happens majority is pilot error. Back to my point the over paid pilots and there union are destroying the airlines.

[Snatch Napkin]

their

[Couver]

The odds of hitting the lotto 10 times in a row is greater than being killed in a plane crash and when it happens majority is pilot error. Back to my point the over paid pilots and there union are destroying the airlines.

Because we have made great strides in training of Pilots and safety of airplanes. I know I only have 20 odd years of aviation experience but I would rather have a pilot who know his shit when it hits the fan.

How many trains have accidents every year vs planes? All they have to do is stay on tracks. Planes have to fly thousands of miles in varying weather conditions and land on a runway. Not glide to a stop over a few miles at a rail yard somewhere. Both jobs are hard I concede that for sure. The difference in pay is your 300 passengers on the plane vs 300 cars of Chaz Bono sex dolls. I wonder what could be more important?

[Snatch Napkin]

I say you would have an argument if you had gone with anything other than Chaz Bono sex dolls.

[quikag]

Haha, nice one, Couver.

[Vertnut]

The odds of hitting the lotto 10 times in a row is greater than being killed in a plane crash and when it happens majority is pilot error. Back to my point the over paid pilots and there union are destroying the airlines.

Odds of average American dying in a plane crash:1/11 million
Odds of average American hitting the Mega Millions: 1/175 million
Odds of winning a state lottery: 1/50 million

Not my numbers.

[quikag]

All this union smack talk aside, if people can get that kind of pay and company management agrees to it, then more power to them. Here in TX for the most part, people get paid, they do good work, the company thrives, and everyone benefits. Unions are not needed. People get paid and benefit on their merits, their experience, and their tenure. They don't need a union like they needed their mommy when they were young on the teet.

[4eyedwillie]

I could go on and on about the quality of the workers, what my dad had to do to make sure his company made money, etc. There was a place for unions when there were sweat shops in the US, safety issues in the workplace, and truly poor wages but with OSHA, wage laws, etc., they are not needed. Only thing they are good for now is ruining businesses.

While I agree with most of your post, I'm not so sure about this part. There are already people arguing to get rid of the minimum wage. There are MANY people (especially on this board) complaining about OSHA safety rules hurting a companies ability to make money. It isn't a stretch to go from there to doing away with minimum wage and OSHA altogether. I could almost get behind the unions time is over bandwagon IF I didn't think that without them things would get VERY bad for workers.

[Snatch Napkin]

All this union smack talk aside, if people can get that kind of pay and company management agrees to it, then more power to them. Here in TX for the most part, people get paid, they do good work, the company thrives, and everyone benefits. Unions are not needed. People get paid and benefit on their merits, their experience, and their tenure. They don't need a union like they needed their mommy when they were young on the teet.

Agreeance has been issued.

[dewayne6243]

Because we have made great strides in training of Pilots and safety of airplanes. I know I only have 20 odd years of aviation experience but I would rather have a pilot who know his shit when it hits the fan.

How many trains have accidents every year vs planes? All they have to do is stay on tracks. Planes have to fly thousands of miles in varying weather conditions and land on a runway. Not glide to a stop over a few miles at a rail yard somewhere. Both jobs are hard I concede that for sure. The difference in pay is your 300 passengers on the plane vs 300 cars of Chaz Bono sex dolls. I wonder what could be more important?

I would believe a train. If we derailed 140 tankers full of anhydrous ammonia it would wipe out an entire town. Why did Warren buffett buy a railroad and not a airline? Because airline employees are over paid and are destroying the industry. Like I said a monkey could do a pilot's job. Flight attendants should be paid $10 an hour. Would u like peanuts with your pillow?

[Couver]

I would believe a train. If we derailed 140 tankers full of anhydrous ammonia it would wipe out an entire town. Why did Warren buffett buy a railroad and not a airline? Because airline employees are over paid and are destroying the industry. Like I said a monkey could do a pilot's job. Flight attendants should be paid $10 an hour. Would u like peanuts with your pillow?

I concede that point as well... But every time a plane takes off say a 100 lives are on the line multiply that by the number of flights it adds up to serious shit. Plus if a plane load of rubber dog shit hits downtown Las Vegas we are talking armageddon.

I believe it was Vertnut who said it earlier. Pilots are trained and paid for when things go bad. I am sure trains are the same way, but with HAZMAT that important then you should be creeping through towns at the speed of smell if you are worried about safety that much.

Apples to Oranges really. When that plane moves there is no shit a lot of people going to die if something goes wrong. A train might have that risk, if the holes in the Swiss cheese line up.

[BradM]

Apples to Oranges really. When that plane moves there is no shit a lot of people going to die if something goes wrong. A train is maybe, if the wrong cargo meets the wrong driver.

Lincolnboy?

[dewayne6243]

I concede that point as well... But every time a plane takes off say a 100 lives are on the line multiply that by the number of flights it adds up to serious shit. Plus if a plane load of rubber dog shit hits downtown Las Vegas we are talking armageddon.

I believe it was Vertnut who said it earlier. Pilots are trained and paid for when things go bad. I am sure trains are the same way, but with HAZMAT that important then you should be creeping through towns at the speed of smell if you are worried about safety that much.


Apples to Oranges really. When that plane moves there is no shit a lot of people going to die if something goes wrong. A train is maybe, if the wrong cargo meets the wrong driver.

And yet they make more than an average medical doctor. I can't wait for American airline to go belly up and fire them all.