Union kills the Twinkie

[bcoop]

I think anyone that's logical will understand it.

That's kind of my point. Generally, grunts aren't logical, and they certainly aren't business minded. They go to work, do their job, and fail to see the bigger picture. As long as they get their CHOOOCHOOO$$$$, it doesn't matter. They don't know how to run a business, or they'd be doing it themselves. They don't know what it takes to run an entire company. They only know how to work their cog in the wheel.

What pisses me off is when they try to blame the workers for all the problems the company had.

The workers are part of the problems the company had. Just like CJ pointed out, when you band together and hold a company hostage, to get paid more than you are worth, you are taking capital from that company, that could be applied to other areas, like debt, for instance.

[Forever_frost]

History has shown there are plenty of incompetent executives. Hence all the business that go bankrupt just like Hostess. Those guys knew it was a sinking ship and partied all the way down. I don't give two shits about that. What pisses me off is when they try to blame the workers for all the problems the company had.

If unions are so amazing, why don't they create their own businesses and run these private entities with their overpaid (have you seen what union leadership make and they produce nothing?) executives? What product does union create? What risks do they take? Nothing. They're parasites that bleed the host dry until it dies.

[bcoop]

LOL and you know what the big boys do because of how? That's what I love about this site. Everyone is an expert on everything.

I never claimed to be an expert. You are acting like you've got it all figured out, but you're just a grunt. You don't know the half of it.

[FreightTrain]

I never claimed to be an expert. You are acting like you've got it all figured out, but you're just a grunt. You don't know the half of it.

At least I know my place. More than I can say for half the folks in this thread.

[bcoop]

At least I know my place.

Obviously not.

[CJ]

History has shown there are plenty of incompetent executives. Hence all the business that go bankrupt just like Hostess. Those guys knew it was a sinking ship and partied all the way down. I don't give two shits about that. What pisses me off is when they try to blame the workers for all the problems the company had.

I'm going to take apart what you said in an attempt to show you your own hypocrisy and further move my point forward.

History has shown there are plenty of incompetent executives. Hence all the business that go bankrupt just like Hostess.

Here you make a blanket statement, suggesting it's common knowledge that your theory is correct, and that executives are incompetent. Then, using this baseless accusation you determine all business that go bankrupt due to executives.

I'm going to quote what I said previously so you can see the irony.

Notice how union workers blame this on "incompetent executives." It's always the executives or the evil big rich men, always.

Do you see what I'm saying now? You didn't even enter into an intelligent discussion using examples or evidence.

Let's discuss bankruptcy. What is bankruptcy FreightTrain? It's when a company is financially insolvent. In other words it brings in less money than it spends to produce a product or service. The job of an executive, among other things, is to make sure they are keeping their costs down in order to produce a product and earn a profit. One of those costs are salaries. Let me explain what would happen in a company that doesn't have unions, I'll walk you through this so you can understand. I know for a fact you do not understand this because if you did, you wouldn't have made that ridiculous conclusion above. In a company without unions, they would assess their expenses, whether that's the facility, management, marketing, workforce, or the raw materials required for the product. Raw materials are by and large a fixed expense, there isn't much room there for improvement. The facility is also a pretty fixed expensive, regardless of the location the size remains the same. Moving locations means moving a workforce which is unrealistic. The workforce is the largest expense in most any manufacturing company. The company was unable to remain solvent because of the free market. Their competition was producing products of similar quality at less cost. The executives determine the only realistic way to cut costs is to reduce the workforce expense. In a free market system, they would simply tell the employees they won't be getting pay increases, or they would be getting a deduction. If you can't afford that, then leave and find another company that thinks you're worth that amount. Problem solved, company continues to produce.

In a union situation, the executives attempt to reduce workforce costs and they can't. The union refuses to accept the pay, they believe they are worth more money, except they would rather hold the company hostage, then switch to another company and get the wage they apparently think they are worth. See, the problem here is they are not worth the money they are paying. Business tells workers what they are worth. Workers do not tell business what they are worth. When they do, companies go out of business like Hostess.

If what you were saying was true, and the executives were the whole problem, why in the world wouldn't another competitor - well versed in the industry - not buy them and install new management? The reason is the unions. That's why they are bidding on the product names and licenses, so they can produce them without the union, which was being unrealistic. You can't cut the wages of executives, they are not line workers. If you tell them they can't have a bonus that is in their contract, then they leave - because they live in the free market - not a union. Then, you try to rehire another executive, but you can't fill the position - why? The free market determines they are worth more than you are willing to pay. Executives don't have unions because they are worth what they are paid. Unions exist because those workers are not worth what they are paid.

[Broncojohnny]

LOL and you know what the big boys do because of how? That's what I love about this site. Everyone is an expert on everything.


Please tell me how many CEO's, CFO's, COO, or just a low level executive of a publicly traded company are on this site. This place is over run with low level management that think they call the shots.

Of course you know less than even the lowest of the low...

[FreightTrain]

I never claimed to be an expert. You are acting like you've got it all figured out, but you're just a grunt. You don't know the half of it.

Of course you know less than even the lowest of the low...

What's yalls job title again?

[CJ]

LOL and you know what the big boys do because of how? That's what I love about this site. Everyone is an expert on everything.


Please tell me how many CEO's, CFO's, COO, or just a low level executive of a publicly traded company are on this site. This place is over run with low level management that think they call the shots.

You don't understand the free market system. I don't have to be an executive to know how a free market operates, and why unions are destructive. If you read my posts, you would actually learn something you probably haven't considered.

What you're saying is you reject logic because it doesn't work for you. The same way unions reject the free market because it doesn't work for them. Quit playing the victim, take some responsibility. We are the ones that have to bail out your unions and all the destruction they cause.

The ignorance blows my mind. Hostess goes bankrupt because the workers took the company hostage. They actively sought the company's destruction in lieu of lower wages. The end result? The executives move onto another company. If the executives are as incompetent as you seem to believe they are, they won't get hired. However, I guarantee you they will have a very logical explanation why Hostess failed. The workers wanted more money than they were worth. The workers lose their job and go on unemployment (which all of us pays for). Then, they will return to the workforce at a lower wage. Who lost here? What is the point of this?

[Broncojohnny]

What's yalls job title again?

"white trash cry baby union worker"

[FreightTrain]

You don't understand the free market system. I don't have to be an executive to know how a free market operates, and why unions are destructive. If you read my posts, you would actually learn something you probably haven't considered.

What you're saying is you reject logic because it doesn't work for you. The same way unions reject the free market because it doesn't work for them. Quit playing the victim, take some responsibility. We are the ones that have to bail out your unions and all the destruction they cause.

LOL yea you got it figured out don't you. What's your job title? I hope they have you on the fast track at your work.

The railroad is 100% union and we make it work. It's not perfect but no marriage is. There has to be give and take on both sides and checks and balances. With all that said both sides contribute and we make billions of dollars a year.

Truth of the matter is everyone in this thread is just a piss ant bitching about something that is way above our pay grade.

[BMCSean]

Fuck Hostess

[Broncojohnny]

You don't understand the free market system. I don't have to be an executive to know how a free market operates, and why unions are destructive. If you read my posts, you would actually learn something you probably haven't considered.

What you're saying is you reject logic because it doesn't work for you. The same way unions reject the free market because it doesn't work for them. Quit playing the victim, take some responsibility. We are the ones that have to bail out your unions and all the destruction they cause.

The ignorance blows my mind. Hostess goes bankrupt because the workers took the company hostage. They actively sought the company's destruction in lieu of lower wages. The end result? The executives move onto another company. If the executives are as incompetent as you seem to believe they are, they won't get hired. However, I guarantee you they will have a very logical explanation why Hostess failed. The workers wanted more money than they were worth. The workers lose their job and go on unemployment (which all of us pays for). Then, they will return to the workforce at a lower wage. Who lost here? What is the point of this?

You are wasting your time trying to explain anything to the simpleton. It is always the fault of the company or the rich man to these people. I have worked in three union shops and the robots are pretty much all the same.

[FreightTrain]

"white trash cry baby union worker"

LOL always good for the laugh.


You remind me of the uncle in the Great out Doors you know the one that puts up the front that he's the big timer driving the Mercedes, but every day he puts on a tie and drives down to the local dinner and puts his apron on. Gosh I need to go find that video clip brb.....

[DON SVO]

LOL always good for the laugh.


You remind me of the uncle in the Great out Doors you know the one that puts up the front that he's the big timer driving the Mercedes, but every day he puts on a tie and drives down to the local dinner and puts his apron on. Gosh I need to go find that video clip brb.....

So have you figured out how many Hostess employees were paying for the executive's salary?