UAW to try to unionize Hundai

[Broncojohnny]

Who cares which state offered more money?

Strangely enough the union doesn't, they just want to sue and hope that Boeing settles before getting into the facts of the case.

We all know that Boeing, a public company, would make a deal that doesn't make sense economically, just to spite the union. It makes perfect sense if you have a tenth grade education and think everyone owes you something.

[BP]

Unions are communist.

I won't go that far but the rest of your post is pretty accurate. In a true communist society everyone should be motivated to work as hard as possible to support the state, for the good of everyone. It's not what happens but it's a nice idea. In a union environment you are motivated to do exactly what is required based on your collective agreement and nothing more which is exactly what happens.

[Broncojohnny]

I won't go that far but the rest of your post is pretty accurate. In a true communist society everyone should be motivated to work as hard as possible to support the state, for the good of everyone. It's not what happens but it's a nice idea. In a union environment you are motivated to do exactly what is required based on your collective agreement and nothing more which is exactly what happens.

What happens in an actual communist society is people only do what they have to do to get by and no one does anything to get ahead because you can't. Much like the environment of a union shop, the lazy get carried along by the ones who actually work but everyone gets the same check. Sounds pretty fair if you are a lazy fat fuck.

[FreightTrain]

What happens in an actual communist society is people only do what they have to do to get by and no one does anything to get ahead because you can't. Much like the environment of a union shop, the lazy get carried along by the ones who actually work but everyone gets the same check. Sounds pretty fair if you are a lazy fat fuck.

I'm not going to defend lazy people period, but be honest with yourself. I don't give a shit where you work, union, or non union there is always going to be a few lazy asses that stand around and collect a check. Even in Texas with a right to work state and non union company it takes forever to fire someone like that. Now days someone is always protected either by race, disability, or some other form of bullshit and the company has to have a documentation trail a mile long to fire someone. If not they will sue or at the very least be able to collect unemployment for 2 years.

[BP]

What happens in an actual communist society is people only do what they have to do to get by and no one does anything to get ahead because you can't. Much like the environment of a union shop, the lazy get carried along by the ones who actually work but everyone gets the same check. Sounds pretty fair if you are a lazy fat fuck.

Yep, I had a good friend that immigrated with his family from China. His best explaination of communism is that it spreads misery amongst the masses. Obviously there are varying degrees of it, some parts of China are no different than living here but other parts suffer massively to prop up the regions they show the world.

[Broncojohnny]

I'm not going to defend lazy people period, but be honest with yourself. I don't give a shit where you work, union, or non union there is always going to be a few lazy asses that stand around and collect a check. Even in Texas with a right to work state and non union company it takes forever to fire someone like that. Now days someone is always protected either by race, disability, or some other form of bullshit and the company has to have a documentation trail a mile long to fire someone. If not they will sue or at the very least be able to collect unemployment for 2 years.

You go tell yourself all that to make yourself feel better and rationalize the nonsense you believe. In a white collar environment we'll fire someone's ass off the roof for not carrying their weight.

[Broncojohnny]

Yep, I had a good friend that immigrated with his family from China. His best explaination of communism is that it spreads misery amongst the masses. Obviously there are varying degrees of it, some parts of China are no different than living here but other parts suffer massively to prop up the regions they show the world.

Trickle up poverty is a great phrase.

[FreightTrain]

You go tell yourself all that to make yourself feel better and rationalize the nonsense you believe. In a white collar environment we'll fire someone's ass off the roof for not carrying their weight.

Thats bullshit and you know it.

[Broncojohnny]

Thats bullshit and you know it.

Oh so now you are going to tell me I'm a liar? We have 17 employees now and we've fired at least six in the last five years. If you don't work here you get your ass fired. We don't care if your kids eat, we don't care if you have a good retirement, we don't care about anything, you get a box and a trip to the fucking parking lot if you don't pull your weight.

[FreightTrain]

Oh so now you are going to tell me I'm a liar? We have 17 employees now and we've fired at least six in the last five years. If you don't work here you get your ass fired. We don't care if your kids eat, we don't care if you have a good retirement, we don't care about anything, you get a box and a trip to the fucking parking lot if you don't pull your weight.

That might work in a very small company were everyone is under a microscope, but go work for a larger company and see what happens. Corporate America is full of lazy asses and some of the stories I've heard from friends wouldn't even fly at my job. On the railroad if you don't do whats expected of you the company just charges you with being insubordinate and your ass is fired. Nothing the union can do.

[GhostTX]

That might work in a very small company were everyone is under a microscope, but go work for a larger company and see what happens. Corporate America is full of lazy asses and some of the stories I've heard from friends wouldn't even fly at my job. On the railroad if you don't do whats expected of you the company just charges you with being insubordinate and your ass is fired. Nothing the union can do.

Where I work, after a quarter of "poor performance", they put you on probation for 30 days with very specific, measurable performance goals. If you don't hit the goal (or better), you're out the door.

Oh, the company did $5.1 billion last year (2010).

[Hell-Bent SS]

Oh so now you are going to tell me I'm a liar? We have 17 employees now and we've fired at least six in the last five years. If you don't work here you get your ass fired. We don't care if your kids eat, we don't care if you have a good retirement, we don't care about anything, you get a box and a trip to the fucking parking lot if you don't pull your weight.

And then what go hire another illegal off the street? I'm a union welder/pipe fitter and if you don't carry your weight on our jobs you get run off like anywhere else. A lot of people think just because your union you can't get fired or laid off and thats so untrue.

[FreightTrain]

Where I work, after a quarter of "poor performance", they put you on probation for 30 days with very specific, measurable performance goals. If you don't hit the goal (or better), you're out the door.

Oh, the company did $5.1 billion last year (2010).

Thanks for making my point. You can be a complete drain for 4 months before you are fired, but be honest. You have to be a complete fuck up and piss alot of folks off before they deem you "poor performance" for a quarter. In other words someone can squeek by doing substandard work for a long time without ever making the radar and being hit with "poor performance."

[Broncojohnny]

That might work in a very small company were everyone is under a microscope, but go work for a larger company and see what happens. Corporate America is full of lazy asses and some of the stories I've heard from friends wouldn't even fly at my job. On the railroad if you don't do whats expected of you the company just charges you with being insubordinate and your ass is fired. Nothing the union can do.

So you heard some stories from friends? Cool story I guess.

I worked in three union shops under two different unions, Teamsters and UAW and I now work in a white collar environment and have been doing so for 15 years.

But I guess your story from your sister's brother's cousin's housekeeper who saw Ferris pass out at 31 flavors last night makes more sense.

[Broncojohnny]

And then what go hire another illegal off the street? I'm a union welder/pipe fitter and if you don't carry your weight on our jobs you get run off like anywhere else. A lot of people think just because your union you can't get fired or laid off and thats so untrue.

It is true in the UAW. I saw a girl hit our supervisor with a piece of a bumper on purpose and she wasn't fired. She was back at work the next day. There was another guy who drank straight Weller 107 from an Apple juice bottle on the assembly line. Happened all the time, no one said a thing. Another guy was asked if he wanted to work overtime, he looked the supervisor in the face and screamed "FUCK YOU!" while flipping him off. Then there was "One day Ray" who would come in about every fourth month for a few hours and get hurt and go out on disability. Yet another guy I called "fox turd" because he used to go hunting and smeared fox turds all over himself to mask his scent would come by my job on the line and turn up a 750 ml of Everclear right in front of everyone. None of these people were fired, none of them were even written up that I know of. If they were ever taken to labor relations, their union rep was in there making sure nothing happened.

The bottom line is you guys can say whatever you want and blow smoke up people's asses about the union environment. You aren't going to piss down my back and tell me its raining though, I was there, I saw it with my own eyes for years. Granted, a skilled trades environment can be different but it isn't that much different, the people who work still carry the lazy asses every day.