Roger Clemens

[Blame Canada]

Mistrial in Clemens case after jurors exposed to evidence.

[BP]

The prosecution pissed off the judge pretty good. Hey good for Clemens, too bad we all know he's guilty.

[pHILSANITY07]

His image is always going to be tainted now, won't get into the Hall of Fame because of this stuff and also the fact that no one likes his additude.

[71chevellejohn]

I almost think the govt doesn't want to follow through with this trial, no matter how guilty clemens appears. What good comes from putting him in prison?

I would just assume they drop the case and save the$$$. They have already sullied his reputation. Just drop it and save the taxpayers money.

[YALE]

Who'd he hurt?

[jdgregory84]

Seriously? Steroids for a pitcher? Arm strength only goes so far. Clemens was an artist with the ball regardless of what he took. Give Arnold a ball and see how well he can throw it. See how much arm strength matter when it comes to breaking balls. Fucking stupid. I can understand purgery, but to deny the fact that he's an amazing pitcher is fucking stupid. Steroids don't improve coordination. Actually, I think "research" says that it impairs it.

[BP]

Who'd he hurt?

Randy Johnson (runner up for the 04 Cy Young) and the 05 Cardinals and Braves. The PED ban went into effect in 2004, technically he wasn't cheating until then. Still though he won two Cy Young awards (over Mark Mulder and Scott Erickson) when he was likely using PEDs regularly. Not to mention all of the other pitchers that missed out on making it to the majors because he cheated and extended his career 4-5 years.

Just imagine how the landscape would look if Greg Maddux, Orel Hershiser and Randy Johnson used PEDs. They could all have pitched well into their mid 40s and would have done a Barry Bonds to all of the pitching records.

In Barry's defense he was a great player before he started cheating. It was watching what McGwire and Sosa did that made him start cheating himself.

[Shorty]

Seriously? Steroids for a pitcher? Arm strength only goes so far. Clemens was an artist with the ball regardless of what he took. Give Arnold a ball and see how well he can throw it. See how much arm strength matter when it comes to breaking balls. Fucking stupid. I can understand purgery, but to deny the fact that he's an amazing pitcher is fucking stupid. Steroids don't improve coordination. Actually, I think "research" says that it impairs it.

You're ignoring the recovery benefits.

[Nash B.]

Seriously? Steroids for a pitcher? Arm strength only goes so far. Clemens was an artist with the ball regardless of what he took. Give Arnold a ball and see how well he can throw it. See how much arm strength matter when it comes to breaking balls.

Nobody's saying he wasn't an amazing pitcher, and you're right, arm strength only goes so far, but there's a lot more to it than just the arm. Legs and core muscles are huge in throwing hard, too, and every pitch (not just the fastball) benefits from increased velocity - more, sharper movement and less time for the batter to pick it up.

And then like Shorty said, recovery.

[ThreeFingerPete]

Stop prosecuting athletes for steroids, and start criminalizing things that matter. You know, like actual crime.

[BP]

Stop prosecuting athletes for steroids, and start criminalizing things that matter. You know, like actual crime.

You know he was on trial for perjury and obstruction of Congress right?

[pHILSANITY07]

You know he was on trial for perjury and obstruction of Congress right?

yea thats why he should be going to jail, not because he took steroids but because he lied to a congressional meeting which is a felony.

[YALE]

Randy Johnson (runner up for the 04 Cy Young) and the 05 Cardinals and Braves. The PED ban went into effect in 2004, technically he wasn't cheating until then. Still though he won two Cy Young awards (over Mark Mulder and Scott Erickson) when he was likely using PEDs regularly. Not to mention all of the other pitchers that missed out on making it to the majors because he cheated and extended his career 4-5 years.

Just imagine how the landscape would look if Greg Maddux, Orel Hershiser and Randy Johnson used PEDs. They could all have pitched well into their mid 40s and would have done a Barry Bonds to all of the pitching records.

In Barry's defense he was a great player before he started cheating. It was watching what McGwire and Sosa did that made him start cheating himself.

I don't think you could classify that as, "harm," as such. Sure, he was dishonest, but unless you could point to demonstrative physical, mental, or economic harm, I just don't see what the hype is over steroids.

You know he was on trial for perjury and obstruction of Congress right?

Yeah, and what was his testimony about?

[ThreeFingerPete]

You know he was on trial for perjury and obstruction of Congress right?

I'm aware. They wanted to make a circus about steroid use, and as such they put these guys on the stand for no good reason. I'm not saying that he didn't lie, I'm just saying that we're wasting a lot of money fucking around with athletes that didn't hurt anyone.

[71chevellejohn]

I don't think you could classify that as, "harm," as such. Sure, he was dishonest, but unless you could point to demonstrative physical, mental, or economic harm, I just don't see what the hype is over steroids.

Any pitcher that came in 2nd and had an incentive based bonus for winning the Cy Young award could have an argument for economic harm - of course that would be a stretch.

The congressional hearing was more about congressmen wanting to meet pro ball players and abusing their power than it was about stopping the flow of steroids. If they are "lawmakers" then the point of holding the hearings was to move forward on making a new steroid law(s). In the six years since, I don't know(or maybe I'm just unaware) of any new federal laws regarding the sale and distribution of steroids.