where does dirk stand?

[mstng86]

Where does dirk stand in the pantheon of Dallas players? For me he is there with staubach, emmit and troy. Granted he has only won once so far, but look how long he has been here and where the franchise was when he showed up.

Where does he fit as far as the NBA goes, and on the list of the great forwards.

[1bad?]

i say he is the best if you have to ask me!!!!!

[juiceweezl]

Where does dirk stand in the pantheon of Dallas players? For me he is there with staubach, emmit and troy. Granted he has only won once so far, but look how long he has been here and where the franchise was when he showed up.

Where does he fit as far as the NBA goes, and on the list of the great forwards.

I'm not a native to Dallas, so take this tongue and cheek. As for the other great Dallas players, he has to be up there with guys like Staubach, Dorsett, Smith, and Aikman. You could probably add Modano in as well. They were all the best or one of the best players and thus leaders on their championship teams. They also all made their name playing lengthy amounts of time in Dallas. No one remembers Smith as a Cardinal -- he's a Cowboy.

As for the NBA, I have a mixed opinion. If you look at the great forwards, he's up there pretty high. I rank him ahead of guys like Karl Malone and Charles Barkley who were great players that even had quite a bit around them at times but never got to the pinnacle of their sport. How much of that is because of a guy named Michael Jordan, well I guess we will never know. Is Dirk as good as a guy like James Worthy? Many people would say Dirk is better, but they probably didn't see Worthy play. I think it's too hard to compare them.

Dirk is a perimeter player who is not explosive at all. He's very methodical, an excellent shooter, and is dangerous when he backs someone down or drives to the basket consistently as he did for the playoffs. Worthy was just explosive. While he wasn't a great shooter per se, he could just explode to the basket and run the floor. You can keep going back and find other guys like that, but it's hard to compare Dirk to them. The game has changed too much.

For me, the question comes down to 2 things.

1) Is Dirk one of the greatest players ever in the NBA? My answer is yes because of what he has accomplished with his team. He won with some duct tape and a little bit of liquid nails. If you were building a team around say Dwight Howard, would you go and try to get anyone off the Mavs roster besides Dirk? Not a chance in hell. For that reason, Dirk has to be one of the NBA's greatest all time when you look at performance in the way of what a player brings to the team and championships.

2) Is Dirk a top 10 player all time? My answer here is no. Now I shift focus to just looking at the player's ability and not performance to the team and championships. There are a lot of guys out there who could take Dirk to the woodshed in 1 on 1 or 3 on 3 matchups. He's a phenomenal talent, but he's not Bill Russell, Wilt, Michael, Magic, Kareem, Oscar, etc.

For what it's worth, I'd take Dirk over a lot of guys that I think are better players because he makes those around him better. That's what made MJ so unique -- he was super talented and singly the best player ever AND he made everyone else better too. That's why he has 6 rings.

[pHILSANITY07]

Good question, mine might be biased cause I didnt see anything before 1995. But with that.

in the DFW area Id put him #1. He made this town into a basketball town, which wasnt anything near that before he got here so he is #1. He is the perfect example of what you want in a franchise player.

Now as the top PF's in the game this is my list.

#1 Tim Duncan
#2 Karl Malone
#3 Dirk Nowitzki
#4 Kevin Garnett
#5 Charles Barkley

[JMAC]

Now as the top PF's in the game this is my list.

#1 Tim Duncan
#2 Karl Malone
#3 Dirk Nowitzki
#4 Kevin Garnett
#5 Charles Barkley

Not bagging on you but the problem lies in all those players,are who you grew up watching. You never saw worthy play and other great forwards. The people that believe Kobe/lbj are > Jordan, have only seen highlights of MJ. They never watched him dominate on both ends, the teams he played night after night. I guess the saying "out of sight, out of mind" holds true.


I think Dirk is a legend, he has proven that he belongs among the elite.

[pHILSANITY07]

Not bagging on you but the problem lies in all those players are who you grew up watching. You never saw worthy play and other great forwards. The people that believe Kobe/lbj are > Jordan, have only seen highlights. I guess the saying "out of sight, out of mind" holds true.


I think Dirk is a legend, he has proven that he belongs among the elite.

I have no problem with the bagging, I didnt see the older guys play i the past. But from the guys I've seen then thats my list. I bet though if I did see the greats then my list would be very different.

[mstng86]

I think when it is all over for dirk, he will pass Malone on your list. Garnett is a little over rated imo. He never won a series in minnesota I believe and he had to go to a big three team to get his ring.

Duncan is probably untouchable though.

[ELVIS]

dont take this as hating, but this is the one year he hasnt choked in the playoffs right? not taking anything away this year, congrats. but hasnt that always been the knock on him is that he would always crap in the playoffs? now he is listed as one of the greats?

god bless.

[momo]

To me Dirk is a top 3 dallas icon. staubach, aikman, dirk.
*of course this is very subjective because it all depends on what is your favorite sport, etc.

as far as the NBA all-time goes, he is a top 25er give or take a few. i think he will eventually be a top 20 player when he hangs it up.

[mstng86]

dont take this as hating, but this is the one year he hasnt choked in the playoffs right? not taking anything away this year, congrats. but hasnt that always been the knock on him is that he would always crap in the playoffs? now he is listed as one of the greats?

god bless.

Actually, his averages jump up in the playoffs. It is the supporting cast that never showed up.

The knock could be that he wasn't enough of a leader to get guys to show up in the past I guess.

[momo]

dont take this as hating, but this is the one year he hasnt choked in the playoffs right? not taking anything away this year, congrats. but hasnt that always been the knock on him is that he would always crap in the playoffs? now he is listed as one of the greats?

god bless.

statistically he was up there with the greats without the title. prior to this i think he was somewhere #22 on the all time scoring list.

yea, he choked in 06 and 07. 2008-2010 he was great in the playoffs and was one of the single bright spots. nothing else about those teams was great however.

in 2011 he played pissed off with a chip on his shoulder and began killing 4th quarters. he is one of the few players who worked his ass off every year to become better as he has gotten older. therefore yes, he is greater now than last year or 2/3/4 years ago. him being the number #1 reason the mavs finally have a championship jumps him a great number of places on all of these lists.

[ELVIS]

Actually, his averages jump up in the playoffs. It is the supporting cast that never showed up.

The knock could be that he wasn't enough of a leader to get guys to show up in the past I guess.

statistically he was up there with the greats without the title. prior to this i think he was somewhere #22 on the all time scoring list.

yea, he choked in 06 and 07. 2008-2010 he was great in the playoffs and was one of the single bright spots. nothing else about those teams was great however.

in 2011 he played pissed off with a chip on his shoulder and began killing 4th quarters. he is one of the few players who worked his ass off every year to become better as he has gotten older. therefore yes, he is greater now than last year or 2/3/4 years ago. him being the number #1 reason the mavs finally have a championship jumps him a great number of places on all of these lists.

cool. it appears i was misinformed. i havent watched the mavs since jim jackson, popeye, kidd were all here.

god bless.

[momo]

The knock could be that he wasn't enough of a leader to get guys to show up in the past I guess.

that's very true, this is the first year he has been vocal. you could just tell he wanted it more and everyone fell in line. i think he earned a lot of respect.

[mstng86]

statistically he was up there with the greats without the title. prior to this i think he was somewhere #22 on the all time scoring list.

yea, he choked in 06 and 07. 2008-2010 he was great in the playoffs and was one of the single bright spots. nothing else about those teams was great however.

in 2011 he played pissed off with a chip on his shoulder and began killing 4th quarters. he is one of the few players who worked his ass off every year to become better as he has gotten older. therefore yes, he is greater now than last year or 2/3/4 years ago. him being the number #1 reason the mavs finally have a championship jumps him a great number of places on all of these lists.

You might be able to attribute the 06 and 07 failures to him choking. I tend to lean more towards avery coaching poorly. Riley schooled him and he screwed us in 07 by making the wrong adjustments.

[pHILSANITY07]

I think when it is all over for dirk, he will pass Malone on your list. Garnett is a little over rated imo. He never won a series in minnesota I believe and he had to go to a big three team to get his ring.

Duncan is probably untouchable though.

I think Garnett should be up there, this is a guy that cam straight out of high school and his first 2 years he wasn't good, but he averaged over 20 ppg and 10 rbs for 10 straight years. He just never really got any help along side of him in minnesota. I enjoyed watching him plat cause he laid it all on the line.